From kajabor at yahoo.com Tue Aug 3 03:32:04 2004 From: kajabor at yahoo.com (Kajabor) Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 10:32:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. Message-ID: <20040802173204.22776.qmail@web54005.mail.yahoo.com> Has anyone else noticed that the Basic Roleplaying Rules and the new RQ3 based advanced rules are no longer visible on Chaosium's web site? Or, at least they're not there when I click on the "Basic Roleplaying and Others" link. Anyone know what happened? --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! From ulo at metrocast.net Tue Aug 3 04:08:27 2004 From: ulo at metrocast.net (Christopher E. Fasulo) Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 14:08:27 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. References: <20040802173204.22776.qmail@web54005.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000601c478bb$b5dcf230$0100a8c0@Beowulf> Same thing happened when I checked it out ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kajabor" To: Sent: Monday, August 02, 2004 1:32 PM Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. > Has anyone else noticed that the Basic Roleplaying Rules and the new RQ3 based advanced rules are no longer visible on Chaosium's web site? Or, at least they're not there when I click on the "Basic Roleplaying and Others" link. > > Anyone know what happened? > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From grogthing at yahoo.com Tue Aug 3 04:15:39 2004 From: grogthing at yahoo.com (grogthing) Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 11:15:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <20040802173204.22776.qmail@web54005.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040802181539.49812.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> I am also on the Basic Roleplaying mail list and there has been a more thorough discussion of the recent goings on reguarding the Deluxe BRP books and what they mean and what is to come. Here is a nutshell version as far as I understand the situation. The Deluxe BRP Players Book and Magic Book were just no frills unillustrated b&w copies of RQ3 with a quick cut and paste job replacing all references of "RuneQuest" with "Basic Roleplaying". It was said that the company that owned the RuneQuest copyright was not retaining the rights the RQ "system" so Chaosium published the above described books in a limited quantity to sell qucikly as legal placeholder so to speak to re-establish their claim to the game system but not the "RuneQuest" moniker. After establishing their legal rights to the material, they plan on doing a makeover and producing a reformatted hardcover Deluxe BRP Core book that also includes modern and sci-fi rules. Or so I've gleaned ;) Make it so! Gregory --- Kajabor wrote: > Has anyone else noticed that the Basic Roleplaying > Rules and the new RQ3 based advanced rules are no > longer visible on Chaosium's web site? Or, at least > they're not there when I click on the "Basic > Roleplaying and Others" link. > > Anyone know what happened? > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > ===== "I have sworn, upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." - Thomas Jefferson "It does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." - Thomas Jefferson "Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry "A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious." - Aristotle __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From slposey at concentric.net Tue Aug 3 05:20:36 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 12:20:36 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <20040802181539.49812.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040802181539.49812.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <410E9404.6080103@concentric.net> grogthing wrote: > I am also on the Basic Roleplaying mail list and there > has been a more thorough discussion of the recent > goings on reguarding the Deluxe BRP books and what > they mean and what is to come. > > Here is a nutshell version as far as I understand the > situation. > > The Deluxe BRP Players Book and Magic Book were just > no frills unillustrated b&w copies of RQ3 with a quick > cut and paste job replacing all references of > "RuneQuest" with "Basic Roleplaying". > > It was said that the company that owned the RuneQuest > copyright was not retaining the rights the RQ "system" > so Chaosium published the above described books in a > limited quantity to sell qucikly as legal placeholder > so to speak to re-establish their claim to the game > system but not the "RuneQuest" moniker. > > After establishing their legal rights to the material, > they plan on doing a makeover and producing a > reformatted hardcover Deluxe BRP Core book that also > includes modern and sci-fi rules. > > Or so I've gleaned ;) Make it so! That's more or less my understanding as well, though I wish they'd left the "monograph" format items up a bit longer, I didn't have time to acquire mine. :-( Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Tue Aug 3 17:47:17 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 08:47:17 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. Message-ID: Stephen Posey wrote: > >That's more or less my understanding as well, though I wish they'd left >the "monograph" format items up a bit longer, I didn't have time to >acquire mine. :-( > Of course, it could just be that the Monographs sold so well that they are currently out of stock (as is the case with several of the Call of Cthulhu Monographs I gather) - and the advantage of the Monograph format is that the turn around time for re-stocking is very short, and small print runs are viable... Whether they'll re-stock the BRP Monographs is a slightly different question, given they were place holders for the more substantive work coming next year (he said hopefully!), but given the obvious demand I can't see that it would do any harm and the point of the Monographs is that they can satisfy this sort of dedicated interest on a sound financial basis. I'd just like more of an idea of what is going in to the big BRP book... Cheers, Nick Middleton From freyrvanic at earthlink.net Wed Aug 4 01:24:30 2004 From: freyrvanic at earthlink.net (Sven Lugar) Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 08:24:30 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. Message-ID: <410-22004823152430406@earthlink.net> I have it on good authority (the Chaosium shipping shoggoth as he styles himself) that is precisely what happened (they sold out really fast) & they are readying themselves for a deluxe release. > [Original Message] > From: > To: RuneQuest rules discussion. > Date: 8/3/2004 2:48:19 AM > Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. > > > Stephen Posey wrote: > > > >That's more or less my understanding as well, though I wish they'd left > >the "monograph" format items up a bit longer, I didn't have time to > >acquire mine. :-( > > > > Of course, it could just be that the Monographs sold so well that they are > currently out of stock (as is the case with several of the Call of Cthulhu > Monographs I gather) - and the advantage of the Monograph format is that > the turn around time for re-stocking is very short, and small print runs > are viable... > > Whether they'll re-stock the BRP Monographs is a slightly different > question, given they were place holders for the more substantive work > coming next year (he said hopefully!), but given the obvious demand I can't > see that it would do any harm and the point of the Monographs is that they > can satisfy this sort of dedicated interest on a sound financial basis. > > I'd just like more of an idea of what is going in to the big BRP book... > > Cheers, > > Nick Middleton > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From slposey at concentric.net Wed Aug 4 02:19:55 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2004 09:19:55 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <410FBB2B.2060104@concentric.net> Nick.Middleton at invensys.com wrote: > Stephen Posey wrote: > >>That's more or less my understanding as well, though I wish they'd left >>the "monograph" format items up a bit longer, I didn't have time to >>acquire mine. :-( > > Of course, it could just be that the Monographs sold so well that they are > currently out of stock (as is the case with several of the Call of Cthulhu > Monographs I gather) - and the advantage of the Monograph format is that > the turn around time for re-stocking is very short, and small print runs > are viable... Perhaps, but if so why not leave the items visible on the web page and just backorder? I notice some other Monograph titles that I'd planned to acquire seem to have vanished as well (Cthulhu Invictus, Paranormal Investigator's Guide). Rather than continue to speculate in the dark, I'm going to drop them a line and ask about the Monographs. If I get any sort of cogent answer I'll forward it here. > Whether they'll re-stock the BRP Monographs is a slightly different > question, given they were place holders for the more substantive work > coming next year (he said hopefully!), but given the obvious demand I can't > see that it would do any harm and the point of the Monographs is that they > can satisfy this sort of dedicated interest on a sound financial basis. > > I'd just like more of an idea of what is going in to the big BRP book... Ditto. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From peter at maranci.net Thu Aug 5 02:00:54 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 12:00:54 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. Message-ID: <299940-2200483416054833@M2W099.mail2web.com> * Stephen Posey (slposey at concentric.net) wrote: >Perhaps, but if so why not leave the items visible on the web page and >just backorder? The problem is a flaw in their web page design. According to someone at Chaosium anything that is sold out, even temporarily, disappears from their site altogether. Apparently they're going to be revamping the site soon, which is a very good idea. They seem to be keeping very quiet about the connection between the new BRP and RQ3, by the way... Oh, almost forgot to mention: I've updated my RQ site somewhat. Several new RQ3 character sheets by Toby Partridge have been added, among other things. At this point they're all Word files in European A4 layout, but I'm hoping to adapt them to US letter size as well. By the way, does anyone here know what happened to Dyson Empire Productions at runequest.net? The URL seems to have fallen into the hands of speculators, who are offering it for US $399.00. Pity. Dyson had some good resources on their site, including an opposed resolution table. Since theirs is gone, I added one to the work-in-progress basic RQ booklet. Which, by the way, I will be *very* happy to abandon if the rumors about the new BRP are true. ->Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com Thu Aug 5 02:32:14 2004 From: katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com (John Raner) Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 09:32:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <299940-2200483416054833@M2W099.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <20040804163214.44684.qmail@web53706.mail.yahoo.com> --- "peter at maranci.net" wrote: > Dyson had some good > resources on their site, including an opposed > resolution table. Since > theirs is gone, I added one to the work-in-progress > basic RQ booklet. I went to your site to see that and noticed you are a Cordwainer Smith fan. I thought I was the only one... :) I use the Underpeople in my PA games. Cheers, John ===== "Keep a government poor and weak and it's your servant; let it get rich and powerful and it's your master." ---- Colonel Andrew Jackson Hickok A state, is called the coldest of all cold monsters. Coldly lieth it also; and this lie creepeth from its mouth: "I, the state, am the people." ---- Friedrich Nietzsche "It is a shame that governments are chiefed by the devil tongues" ---- Chief Ten Bears "There is no such thing as an obsolete weapon or tool, merely obsolete thinking in its employ." ---- Mark D. (CapnCarp at yahoo.com) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From slposey at concentric.net Thu Aug 5 02:34:53 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Wed, 04 Aug 2004 09:34:53 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <20040804163214.44684.qmail@web53706.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040804163214.44684.qmail@web53706.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4111102D.3000002@concentric.net> John Raner wrote: > --- "peter at maranci.net" wrote: > >>Dyson had some good >>resources on their site, including an opposed >>resolution table. Since >>theirs is gone, I added one to the work-in-progress >>basic RQ booklet. > > I went to your site to see that and noticed you are a > Cordwainer Smith fan. I thought I was the only one... > :) I use the Underpeople in my PA games. You've got another CS here too, though it's been like 20 years since I read any of his stories. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From slposey at concentric.net Thu Aug 5 02:39:21 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Wed, 04 Aug 2004 09:39:21 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <410FBB2B.2060104@concentric.net> References: <410FBB2B.2060104@concentric.net> Message-ID: <41111139.9010908@concentric.net> Stephen Posey wrote: >> Of course, it could just be that the Monographs sold so well that they >> are >> currently out of stock (as is the case with several of the Call of >> Cthulhu >> Monographs I gather) - and the advantage of the Monograph format is that >> the turn around time for re-stocking is very short, and small print runs >> are viable... > > Perhaps, but if so why not leave the items visible on the web page and > just backorder? > > I notice some other Monograph titles that I'd planned to acquire seem to > have vanished as well (Cthulhu Invictus, Paranormal Investigator's Guide). > > Rather than continue to speculate in the dark, I'm going to drop them a > line and ask about the Monographs. If I get any sort of cogent answer > I'll forward it here. I received the appended reply from Fergie at Chaosium when I asked about the missing monographs (sounds like a CoC scenario: "The Tale of the Missing Monographs"). Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net -------------------->8 cut here 8<-------------------- > From: Stephen Posey [mailto:slposey at concentric.net] > Sent: Tuesday, August 03, 2004 8:26 AM > To: Chaosium Inc. > Subject: Enquiry from Chaosium.com > > I notice that several of your \"monograph\" titles seem to have disappeared > from your catalog. I was planning to acquire these sometime soon. > > In particular: > Cthulhu Invictus > Parapsychologists Handbook > The Abbey > Basic Role Playing Player\'s Book > Basic Role Playing Magic Book > > Are you going to re-stock these? Any enlightenment you can offer would be > appreciated. > > Thanks, > > Stephen Posey > slposey at concentric.net Hi Stephen Chaosium will certainly have these titles available shortly, possibly early next week. If you have any other questions or comments, please let me know. Regards Fergie, the shippin' shoggoth fergie at chaosium.com -------------------->8 cut here 8<-------------------- From slposey at concentric.net Thu Aug 5 02:40:13 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Wed, 04 Aug 2004 09:40:13 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <4111102D.3000002@concentric.net> References: <20040804163214.44684.qmail@web53706.mail.yahoo.com> <4111102D.3000002@concentric.net> Message-ID: <4111116D.605@concentric.net> Stephen Posey wrote: > You've got another CS here too, though it's been like 20 years since I > read any of his stories. Ooops, meant to say "CS fan" there. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From peter at maranci.net Thu Aug 5 04:56:55 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 14:56:55 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. Message-ID: <179110-220048341856551@M2W034.mail2web.com> * John Raner wrote: >I went to your site to see that and noticed you are a >Cordwainer Smith fan. I thought I was the only one... >:) I use the Underpeople in my PA games. Smith was amazing. Anyone who like CS should definitely pick up the two books put out by NESFA - the complete collection of his short SF and the authoritative edition of his only SF novel, Norstrilia. I'd like to hear how the Underpeople worked in your game. * Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net wrote: >You've got another CS fan here too, though it's been like 20 years since I >read any of his stories. Might be a good time to pick them up again! I always thought that the world of the Instrumentality would make an *incredible* setting for a RuneQuest campaign - with the rules suitably modified, of course. I actually started work on a campaign many years ago, set during the time of the Rediscovery of Man. Never finished it, though. If Chaosium decides to take BRP on the GURPS path, the Instrumentality is one background that I would buy in a heartbeat. His estate might well be open to the possibility of a license, if they were convinced that the work would be treated respectfully - Smith's daughter is a huge fan of her father, and publishes a site devoted to his writings. Hmm, this leads me to an interesting topic: what other worlds would we like to see licensed for BRP? Sorry for all the OT stuff! ->Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From viktor.haag at gmail.com Thu Aug 5 05:33:49 2004 From: viktor.haag at gmail.com (Viktor Haag) Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 15:33:49 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <179110-220048341856551@M2W034.mail2web.com> References: <179110-220048341856551@M2W034.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <1786319f040804123333a38f65@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 4 Aug 2004 14:56:55 -0400, peter at maranci.net wrote: > Hmm, this leads me to an interesting topic: what other worlds would we like > to see licensed for BRP? I would absolutely love to see a BRP treatment of Steve Erikson's Malazan Empire books. However, I strongly suspect that getting a grip on the magic "system" would present great difficulties. The races in the books vary wildly in power, and magic is grossly powerful, and ergo human life is cheap. Still, it's a fascinating and detailed setting with a heavy emphasis on grittiness that just yells out "RuneQuest" (ahem, excuse me) "BRP"! Also, a BRP version of the Firefly/Serenity universe wouldn't go amiss, but I suspect that Eden's already got the rights to go with their Unisystem. But all things considered, I think I'd prefer to see BRP/RQ used to support a wider variety of non-licensed worlds, a la D20; it's hard enough to stay afloat in this biz, but paying for licensing is probably overhead that most houses just can't really afford. From slposey at concentric.net Thu Aug 5 05:46:51 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Wed, 04 Aug 2004 12:46:51 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <179110-220048341856551@M2W034.mail2web.com> References: <179110-220048341856551@M2W034.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <41113D2B.9060902@concentric.net> peter at maranci.net wrote: > I always thought that the world of the Instrumentality would make an > *incredible* setting for a RuneQuest campaign - with the rules suitably > modified, of course. I actually started work on a campaign many years ago, > set during the time of the Rediscovery of Man. Never finished it, though. > > If Chaosium decides to take BRP on the GURPS path, the Instrumentality is > one background that I would buy in a heartbeat. His estate might well be > open to the possibility of a license, if they were convinced that the work > would be treated respectfully - Smith's daughter is a huge fan of her > father, and publishes a site devoted to his writings. This brings up a topic: Assuming Chaosium does go through with making BRP into a generic system; what are folks' opinions about the relative merits of doing "licensed" environments vs. something more generic? Clearly Chaosium has had its major success in a licenced situation (Lovecraft/Cthulhu Mythos), but does that mean it's a shoe-in "licensed=more sales"? > Hmm, this leads me to an interesting topic: what other worlds would we like > to see licensed for BRP? I was gunning for them to do Conan as an alternate CoC world (with Stormbringer cross-over potential), but Mongoose grabbed it first with their OGL book . Are we talking only things that don't already have a current RPG licencer in play? How about: * Edgar Rice Burroughs' Barsoom (though I hear the Burroughs estate is a bear to work with) * Jules Verne (foundation for a steampunk background, his stories may be public domain by now, don't know). * Alien (great gritty Sci Fi setting) * Harry Potter? * Tomb Raider? For fantasy, I'd love to see a solid treatment of Clark Ashton Smith's Zothique. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From pmj at comhem.se Thu Aug 5 07:36:22 2004 From: pmj at comhem.se (Peter Johansson) Date: Wed, 04 Aug 2004 23:36:22 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <179110-220048341856551@M2W034.mail2web.com> References: <179110-220048341856551@M2W034.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <411156D6.4060304@comhem.se> peter at maranci.net wrote: >Hmm, this leads me to an interesting topic: what other worlds would we like >to see licensed for BRP? > The world from Eidos stealth computer game "Thief". I'm playing Thief 3 at the moment (actually I will take it up again as soon as I have sent this e-mail) and I love it just as much as the first two games. And by coincidence, when I was in the middle of playing yesterday it struck me that I would like to play RQ in that world. :-) /Peter J From katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com Thu Aug 5 08:32:57 2004 From: katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com (John Raner) Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 15:32:57 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <179110-220048341856551@M2W034.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <20040804223257.74546.qmail@web53706.mail.yahoo.com> --- "peter at maranci.net" wrote: > Smith was amazing. Anyone who like CS should > definitely pick up the two > books put out by NESFA - the complete collection of > his short SF and the > authoritative edition of his only SF novel, > Norstrilia. I've been eyeballing those for months now. Just as soon as I can convince the wife that we need those I'll get them ;) > I'd like to hear how the Underpeople worked in your > game. They worked well. It was a Gamma World game and I used Smith's ideas to explain the existance of mutated animals. In my game, the origins of the underpeople were largely unknown, since the war had happened several hundred years in the past. Since none of my players had read Cordwainer Smith, no one picked up on the clues I threw out. Cheers, John ===== "Keep a government poor and weak and it's your servant; let it get rich and powerful and it's your master." ---- Colonel Andrew Jackson Hickok A state, is called the coldest of all cold monsters. Coldly lieth it also; and this lie creepeth from its mouth: "I, the state, am the people." ---- Friedrich Nietzsche "It is a shame that governments are chiefed by the devil tongues" ---- Chief Ten Bears "There is no such thing as an obsolete weapon or tool, merely obsolete thinking in its employ." ---- Mark D. (CapnCarp at yahoo.com) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com Thu Aug 5 09:14:28 2004 From: katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com (John Raner) Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 16:14:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <179110-220048341856551@M2W034.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <20040804231428.97672.qmail@web53704.mail.yahoo.com> --- "peter at maranci.net" wrote: > Hmm, this leads me to an interesting topic: what > other worlds would we like > to see licensed for BRP? I would like to see "The Tripods" or "Daybreak: 2250 A.D." get a licenced setting. H. Beam Piper's Terro-Human Future History and Paratime settings would be very nice..... Cheers, John ===== "Keep a government poor and weak and it's your servant; let it get rich and powerful and it's your master." ---- Colonel Andrew Jackson Hickok A state, is called the coldest of all cold monsters. Coldly lieth it also; and this lie creepeth from its mouth: "I, the state, am the people." ---- Friedrich Nietzsche "It is a shame that governments are chiefed by the devil tongues" ---- Chief Ten Bears "There is no such thing as an obsolete weapon or tool, merely obsolete thinking in its employ." ---- Mark D. (CapnCarp at yahoo.com) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Thu Aug 5 18:17:10 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 09:17:10 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. Message-ID: >peter at maranci.net wrote: > >> I always thought that the world of the Instrumentality would make an >> *incredible* setting for a RuneQuest campaign - with the rules suitably >> modified, of course. I actually started work on a campaign many years ago, >> set during the time of the Rediscovery of Man. Never finished it, though. >> >> If Chaosium decides to take BRP on the GURPS path, the Instrumentality is >> one background that I would buy in a heartbeat. His estate might well be >> open to the possibility of a license, if they were convinced that the work >> would be treated respectfully - Smith's daughter is a huge fan of her >> father, and publishes a site devoted to his writings. > >This brings up a topic: Assuming Chaosium does go through with making >BRP into a generic system; what are folks' opinions about the relative >merits of doing "licensed" environments vs. something more generic? I find it _very_ telling that Monte Cook (one of the few "bankable" names in d20, and with a certain cachet in the wider RPG market) has said that he cannot see circumstances in which Malhavoc Press (his gaming imprint) would touch a licensed property - the creative restrictions and financial overheads make it entirely unattractive apparently. >Clearly Chaosium has had its major success in a licenced situation >(Lovecraft/Cthulhu Mythos), but does that mean it's a shoe-in >"licensed=more sales"? The Cthulhu Mythos is a special case in that, as one of the first gaming licenses, there was less money involved and less interference from the rights holder in the game. Compare this with Farscape d20, which has largely been killed by Henson Internationals delay in approving the core book (it was IIRC something like a year late to market, just in time for the backlash as the series was cancelled...). TSR was paying an absolute fortune (on the order of _millions_ of dollars, IIRC) for one license (I speculate that it was Lankhmar) that was used by less than 5% of its customers when WotC took over. >> Hmm, this leads me to an interesting topic: what other worlds would we like >> to see licensed for BRP? > >I was gunning for them to do Conan as an alternate CoC world (with >Stormbringer cross-over potential), but Mongoose grabbed it first with >their OGL book . This also demonstrates the other danger of licensed products - the market is conditioned by the likes of Mongoose's B5 etc, so expect high volume, glossy art in full colour#. Is it worth Chaosium (or any other "small" RPG publisher) taking on such risks? Pelgrane Press are doing sterling work on the Dying Earth game, but one suspects that they have a slightly unique license with Vance, and my impression of SJG's approach is that unless the terms are realistic (i.e. acknowledges that table-top RPG's are a small market and that approval turn round must be speedy and efficient, so both parties have to be reasonable), they aren't interested. >Are we talking only things that don't already have a current RPG >licencer in play? How about: > >* Edgar Rice Burroughs' Barsoom (though I hear the Burroughs estate is a >bear to work with) >* Jules Verne (foundation for a steampunk background, his stories may be >public domain by now, don't know). >* Alien (great gritty Sci Fi setting) >* Harry Potter? IIRC JK Rowling has indicated that this will happen over her dead body; thus, more accurately, 70 years after her death... >* Tomb Raider? This would be a fun supplement for Call of Cthulhu actually - but it would be cheaper to do without the license and draw on the Tomb Raider/Relic Hunter/Indiana Jones/Rider haggard motif for the three CoC era's... >For fantasy, I'd love to see a solid treatment of Clark Ashton Smith's >Zothique. I presume you are aware of the Averoigne stuff for CDA planned for Words of Cthulhu magazine? Zothique itself may well get snapped up soon for some system - IIRC there is already a fan d20 version out there. Whilst I'd love to see the Malazan Book of the Fallen in BRP (and suspect that actually there is far more of a system underlying the magic and gods than Erikson has yet revealed), not to mention a host of others, it really depends on how they are done. The Mongoose approach to licensed world building (as pinched from Witless W*nkers World of Pretentious Posturing, who nicked the idea from TSR and made it work...) is to paper over the entire universe in ever greater detail on ever more obscure parts of the setting with ever more munchkin rules add-ons so everyone feels compelled to keep buying more and more books (which are often padded out with execrable "IC" material that makes the worst fan-fic look good). This I feel is not a good idea (can you tell?). The SJG/GURPS technique of an initial well researched volume, and then the occasional supplement to basically the same high standard seems more acceptable, albeit it is obviously less of a cash cow. Frankly, given that Athas, Jorune, Tekumel, Talislanta, Glorantha and Dor-Erthenos## have all seen print as game worlds first, I think Chaosium and we would be better served by them eschewing licensed properties and concentrating on solid games of their own. If fans are burning for a conversion of their favourite fictional setting, they can do one of their own, and Chaosium should encourage that; but they have more important things to be spending their limited funds on IMO and fan aspirations can (and SHOULD) be addressed through a tolerant policy towards fan works distributed on the net and a liberal rule licensing policy. Cheers, Nick Middleton # and probably hard backs on mostly vapid, over-written, poorly edited rubbish barely related to the setting... but I digress ;) ## All game worlds I think of as showing some originality and flair. If we include the more workman like merely "solidly entertaining" ones: Forgotten Realms (as originally published, TSR went mad in the 1990's but the original setting as detailed in supplements like Savage Frontier and Under Illefarn has some charm), Greyhawk, Urthe, TORG, Bushido's Nippon, Warhammer's Old World, Cidri, Frontiers of Alusia, Perilous Lands, Shadow World... the list is huge, and I haven't mentioned ANY of the new worlds d20 has spawned (apart from Dor-Erthenos). From tom at zunder.org.uk Thu Aug 5 19:54:20 2004 From: tom at zunder.org.uk (Tom Zunder) Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 10:54:20 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Malazan Empire In-Reply-To: <20040804193426.A53002226DC@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: <411211DC.22166.3EEEB3D@localhost> Oh goodness yes! The Malazan books from Steven Erikson just cried out BRP to me as well. He is also a roleplayer, but a D&D player I believe. I think that the setting would work very well with BRP, I even started to work out how to build the magic/religion system around the House concept. It'd work.. Someone mentioned a basic roleplaying mailing list, could you point me to it? -- Tom Zunder - tom at zunder.org.uk ICQ: 152799 YM!: tzunder AOL: tomzunder MSN: (as email) http://tavern.elric.org.uk http://www.zunder.org.uk From lancelot at inetnebr.com Thu Aug 5 22:13:32 2004 From: lancelot at inetnebr.com (lance dyas) Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 07:13:32 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4112246C.8010008@inetnebr.com> Nick.Middleton at invensys.com wrote: >>peter at maranci.net wrote: >> >> >> >>* Harry Potter? >> >> > >IIRC JK Rowling has indicated that this will happen over her dead body; >thus, more accurately, 70 years after her death... > > > I personally think this response of hers is due to a strong misunderstanding of roleplaying by a non-gamer. She has a strong sense of IP on her characters (which she is making hand over fist on), and somehow thinks a roleplaying game is giving others "permission to tell stories of her characters"???? -- Lance Dyas Lost Worlds Roleplaying - at the Decision Driven Gaming Center http://www.dyasdesigns.com/roleplay/LostWorlds From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Thu Aug 5 22:24:25 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 13:24:25 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. Message-ID: >Nick.Middleton at invensys.com wrote: > >>peter at maranci.net wrote: >> >> >>* Harry Potter? >> > >IIRC JK Rowling has indicated that this will happen over her dead body; >thus, more accurately, 70 years after her death... > >I personally think this response of hers is due to a strong misunderstanding of roleplaying by a non-gamer. She has >a strong >sense of IP on her characters (which she is making hand over fist >on), and somehow thinks a roleplaying game is giving others "permission >to tell stories of her characters"???? Indeed, although I do rather admire her stance, given that effectively she's turning down income (albeit only a modest one compared to film rights etc). But even if JKR was willing, would the expense and production overheads (approvals, limited artists etc) warrant the added sales, especially for a small outfit like Chaosium? Especially as, despite the hype, the "School for Wizards" schtick and all it's paraphernalia is neither original nor JKR's exclusive copy-right: a generic "trainee magicians" in a magical society that exists in parallel with but concealed from our own modern world is a perfectly doable supplement... in fact there may even be d20 one out already... Cheers, Nick Middleton From viktor.haag at gmail.com Thu Aug 5 23:06:10 2004 From: viktor.haag at gmail.com (Viktor Haag) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 09:06:10 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1786319f04080506065c259daa@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 13:24:25 +0100, nick.middleton at invensys.com > But even if JKR was willing, would the expense and production overheads > (approvals, limited artists etc) warrant the added sales, especially for a > small outfit like Chaosium? Especially as, despite the hype, the "School > for Wizards" schtick and all it's paraphernalia is neither original nor > JKR's exclusive copy-right: a generic "trainee magicians" in a magical > society that exists in parallel with but concealed from our own modern > world is a perfectly doable supplement... in fact there may even be d20 one > out already... Of course there is -- the Redhurst sourcebook from Human Head Studios and Green Ronin: I don't own a copy myself, but a friend says it has lots of rather interesting ideas in it. I've also heard that Ursula LeGuin has always been dead set against anyone licensing Earthsea for rolegaming purposes, on the basis that rolegaming is only a positive activity if you come up with the settings and stories yourself. I don't have any reference for this opinion, and all I remember is that the opinion came to me hearsay, so she may not, in fact, feel this way. And yet we have no "Earthsea RPG" (not that I think we need one). -- Viktor From viktor.haag at gmail.com Thu Aug 5 23:35:59 2004 From: viktor.haag at gmail.com (Viktor Haag) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 09:35:59 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1786319f04080506356a8bcdd3@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 13:24:25 +0100, nick.middleton at invensys.com > But even if JKR was willing, would the expense and production overheads > (approvals, limited artists etc) warrant the added sales, especially for a > small outfit like Chaosium? Especially as, despite the hype, the "School > for Wizards" schtick and all it's paraphernalia is neither original nor > JKR's exclusive copy-right: a generic "trainee magicians" in a magical > society that exists in parallel with but concealed from our own modern > world is a perfectly doable supplement... in fact there may even be d20 one > out already... Of course there is -- the Redhurst sourcebook from Human Head Studios and Green Ronin: I don't own a copy myself, but a friend says it has lots of rather interesting ideas in it. I've also heard that Ursula LeGuin has always been dead set against anyone licensing Earthsea for rolegaming purposes, on the basis that rolegaming is only a positive activity if you come up with the settings and stories yourself. I don't have any reference for this opinion, and all I remember is that the opinion came to me hearsay, so she may not, in fact, feel this way. And yet we have no "Earthsea RPG" (not that I think we need one). -- Viktor From talmeta at talmeta.net Thu Aug 5 23:40:43 2004 From: talmeta at talmeta.net (Tal Meta) Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 09:40:43 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Broomstix... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <411238DB.8080703@talmeta.net> Nick.Middleton at invensys.com wrote: > But even if JKR was willing, would the expense and production overheads > (approvals, limited artists etc) warrant the added sales, especially for a > small outfit like Chaosium? Especially as, despite the hype, the "School > for Wizards" schtick and all it's paraphernalia is neither original nor > JKR's exclusive copy-right: a generic "trainee magicians" in a magical > society that exists in parallel with but concealed from our own modern > world is a perfectly doable supplement... in fact there may even be d20 one > out already... I haven't seen a d20 version, but there's a pdf floating around cyberspace purporting to be "Broomstix: The Harry Potter RPG". Can be found in the places where other RPG pdfs can be found lounging about, one imagines... The system looks more like Space: 1889 than anything else, on a quick perusal (I could be wrong; I just hunted it up to make sure it wasn't d20 afterall...) -- talmeta at talmeta.net - Heretic, Dilettante, & God-Machine AIM - talmeta ICQ - 12594453 Homepage - i am the hate you try to hide From lancelot at inetnebr.com Thu Aug 5 23:52:00 2004 From: lancelot at inetnebr.com (lance dyas) Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 08:52:00 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <1786319f04080506065c259daa@mail.gmail.com> References: <1786319f04080506065c259daa@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <41123B80.8010500@inetnebr.com> Viktor Haag wrote: >On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 13:24:25 +0100, nick.middleton at invensys.com > > > >>But even if JKR was willing, would the expense and production overheads >>(approvals, limited artists etc) warrant the added sales, especially for a >>small outfit like Chaosium? Especially as, despite the hype, the "School >>for Wizards" schtick and all it's paraphernalia is neither original nor >>JKR's exclusive copy-right: a generic "trainee magicians" in a magical >>society that exists in parallel with but concealed from our own modern >>world is a perfectly doable supplement... in fact there may even be d20 one >>out already... >> >> Back in highschool (late 70's) I had a dream about a college which was a castle where-in one learned wizardry right along science the idea has been a long time out there. Talislanta (old game) had a supplement which portrays a magical school with named professors curiculum and books. > >Of course there is -- the Redhurst sourcebook from Human Head Studios >and Green Ronin: > > > >I don't own a copy myself, but a friend says it has lots of rather >interesting ideas in it. > >I've also heard that Ursula LeGuin has always been dead set against >anyone licensing Earthsea for rolegaming purposes, on the basis that >rolegaming is only a positive activity if you come up with the >settings and stories yourself. I don't have any reference for this >opinion, and all I remember is that the opinion came to me hearsay, so >she may not, in fact, feel this way. And yet we have no "Earthsea RPG" >(not that I think we need one). > > > I am champing at the bit for the show coming out tho ;-) -- Lance Dyas Google Me under : Lost Worlds Roleplaying -- Lance Dyas Lost Worlds Roleplaying - at the Decision Driven Gaming Center http://www.dyasdesigns.com/roleplay/LostWorlds From rico at ricosweb.com Fri Aug 6 00:29:00 2004 From: rico at ricosweb.com (Rich Allen) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 08:29:00 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <4112246C.8010008@inetnebr.com> Message-ID: <2004858290.374523@laptop> On Thu, 05 Aug 2004 07:13:32 -0500, lance dyas wrote: >>IIRC JK Rowling has indicated that this will happen over her dead body; >>thus, more accurately, 70 years after her death... >> >> >?I personally think this response of hers is due to a strong misunderstanding of roleplaying by a non-gamer. She has a strong >?sense of IP on her characters (which she is making hand over fist >?on), and somehow thinks a roleplaying game is giving others "permission >?to tell stories of her characters"???? But that *is* essentially what she would be allowing. You cannot publish a game setting without telling some kind of story involving the main characters of that setting. At least not if you want to sell more than a few copies. Rich Allen From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Fri Aug 6 00:36:24 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 15:36:24 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. Message-ID: >On Thu, 05 Aug 2004 07:13:32 -0500, lance dyas wrote: >>>IIRC JK Rowling has indicated that this will happen over her dead body; >>>thus, more accurately, 70 years after her death... >>> >>> >>?I personally think this response of hers is due to a strong misunderstanding of roleplaying by a non-gamer. She >>has a strong >>?sense of IP on her characters (which she is making hand over fist >>?on), and somehow thinks a roleplaying game is giving others "permission >>?to tell stories of her characters"???? > >But that *is* essentially what she would be allowing. You cannot publish a game setting without telling some kind >of story involving the main characters of that setting. At least not if you want to sell more than a few copies. Which may well explain Chaosium's difficulties with Stormbringer/Elric! over the years as apart from the original scenario books The Stealer of Souls and The Black Sword, NONE of the published supplements have featured Elric IIRC. Frankly however, I think they are the better for it. If the fantasy setting is so weak it cannot hold the players and GM's interest without wheeling on the characters from the fiction it is derived from then it probably wasn't worth the effort adapting to an RPG in the first place IMO... Cheers, Nick Middleton From gianni at basicrps.com Fri Aug 6 00:01:55 2004 From: gianni at basicrps.com (Gianni) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 16:01:55 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1091714515.41123dd394d58@imp.webhuset.no> Hi gang > >> Hmm, this leads me to an interesting topic: what other worlds would we > like > >> to see licensed for BRP? I would like to see well-researched, historical settings (? la Sengoku). > >* Alien (great gritty Sci Fi setting) There was an official# Alien BRPS supplement in Italy by Stratelibri. Gianni #there was a small 'Twentieth Century Fox' logo on _each_ fucking page of the supplement. From gianni at basicrps.com Fri Aug 6 00:06:01 2004 From: gianni at basicrps.com (Gianni) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 16:06:01 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Malazan Empire In-Reply-To: <411211DC.22166.3EEEB3D@localhost> References: <411211DC.22166.3EEEB3D@localhost> Message-ID: <1091714761.41123ec92bda3@imp.webhuset.no> Quoting Tom Zunder : > Someone mentioned a basic roleplaying mailing list, could you point > me to it? Actually there are two. You can subscribe to mine through subscribe at basicrps.com Cheers Gianni webmaster of basicrps.com From carpgachair at yahoo.com Fri Aug 6 01:16:38 2004 From: carpgachair at yahoo.com (Paul Cardwell) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 08:16:38 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <20040804231428.97672.qmail@web53704.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040805151638.74147.qmail@web51308.mail.yahoo.com> --- John Raner wrote: > I would like to see "The Tripods" or "Daybreak: 2250 > A.D." get a licenced setting. H. Beam Piper's > Terro-Human Future History and Paratime settings > would > be very nice..... I have long used Piper's Little Fuzzy species as a PC in Mythworld. Excellent concealment, but rather delicate in a melee. Paul Cardwell __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com Fri Aug 6 01:22:43 2004 From: katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com (John Raner) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 08:22:43 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Malazan Empire In-Reply-To: <1091714761.41123ec92bda3@imp.webhuset.no> Message-ID: <20040805152243.76903.qmail@web53701.mail.yahoo.com> --- Gianni wrote: > > Someone mentioned a basic roleplaying mailing > list, could you point > > me to it? > > Actually there are two. > > You can subscribe to mine through > subscribe at basicrps.com And you can subscribe to mine at: http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/brpsystem/ Cheers, John ===== "Keep a government poor and weak and it's your servant; let it get rich and powerful and it's your master." ---- Colonel Andrew Jackson Hickok A state, is called the coldest of all cold monsters. Coldly lieth it also; and this lie creepeth from its mouth: "I, the state, am the people." ---- Friedrich Nietzsche "It is a shame that governments are chiefed by the devil tongues" ---- Chief Ten Bears "There is no such thing as an obsolete weapon or tool, merely obsolete thinking in its employ." ---- Mark D. (CapnCarp at yahoo.com) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From peter at maranci.net Fri Aug 6 01:52:11 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 11:52:11 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: <306750-2200484515521170@M2W088.mail2web.com> Thought I'd update the thread title, if no one minds. One world I was tempted to adapt for RQ was Lawrence Watt-Evans' "Lords of Dus" series. I even asked him about it, online (we have corresponded a bit) and he advised me not to tell him about it for legal reasons. :D There are a lot of worlds that would be great to adapt, but I tend to agree with others who suspect that a license costs more than you would gain from enhanced sales. Good, original world-settings are a better idea, particularly if they feature a lot of variety. For example, I'd like to see worlds with wildly differing magic systems. One advantage of the RQ/BRP system is that it is amazingly flexible. I'd LOVE to see the Floating Isles world that I've used (created a long time ago by a friend of mine, inspired by Yes album covers) published for BRP. A "world" composed of nothing but islands of rocks floating in endless blue sky is just the sort of unusual setting that's really refreshing. Now that I think of it, there are a ton of possibilities for really different and fun original game-worlds. As long as they were written and marketed well, there should be no need to spend huge sums on licenses. I'll be weak now, though, and throw out a bunch of literary worlds I'd like to see adapted into games: Asimov's Foundation, Hughart's Ancient China That Never Was, Herbert's Dosadi universe, Clavell's Shogun (this could just be Japan of 1600, of course), Kipling's Kim and The Jungle Books, First Comics' Grimjack and Badger, James White's Hospital series, Zelazny's Lord of Light, Laumer's Bolos, Lawrence Watt-Evans' Ethshar...okay, I'll stop now. :D ->Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From slposey at concentric.net Fri Aug 6 02:16:54 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 09:16:54 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <4112246C.8010008@inetnebr.com> References: <4112246C.8010008@inetnebr.com> Message-ID: <41125D76.2050308@concentric.net> lance dyas wrote: > Nick.Middleton at invensys.com wrote: > >>> peter at maranci.net wrote: >>> >>> * Harry Potter? >> >> IIRC JK Rowling has indicated that this will happen over her dead body; >> thus, more accurately, 70 years after her death... >> > I personally think this response of hers is due to a strong > misunderstanding of roleplaying by a non-gamer. She has a strong > sense of IP on her characters (which she is making hand over fist > on), and somehow thinks a roleplaying game is giving others "permission > to tell stories of her characters"???? That's certainly her prerogative, but unless she's got similarly strong feelings about "fan fic" based on them, it sounds hypocritical to me. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From slposey at concentric.net Fri Aug 6 02:20:52 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 09:20:52 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <1091714515.41123dd394d58@imp.webhuset.no> References: <1091714515.41123dd394d58@imp.webhuset.no> Message-ID: <41125E64.4040503@concentric.net> Gianni wrote: >>>* Alien (great gritty Sci Fi setting) > > There was an official# Alien BRPS supplement in Italy by Stratelibri. I knew that. So the core material is already there. I suspect though that licensing Alien for an Italian language only game supplement would be cheaper and easier to maintain than doing similar for an English language one for release in the US. > Gianni > > #there was a small 'Twentieth Century Fox' logo on _each_ fucking page of the > supplement. Typical. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From slposey at concentric.net Fri Aug 6 02:30:11 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 09:30:11 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41126093.2020602@concentric.net> Nick.Middleton at invensys.com wrote: >>On Thu, 05 Aug 2004 07:13:32 -0500, lance dyas wrote: >> >>>>IIRC JK Rowling has indicated that this will happen over her dead body; >>>>thus, more accurately, 70 years after her death... >>>> >>>> >>> >>> I personally think this response of hers is due to a strong > > misunderstanding of roleplaying by a non-gamer. She >>has a strong > >>> sense of IP on her characters (which she is making hand over fist >>> on), and somehow thinks a roleplaying game is giving others "permission >>> to tell stories of her characters"???? >> >>But that *is* essentially what she would be allowing. You cannot publish > > a game setting without telling some kind >of story involving the main > characters of that setting. At least not if you want to sell more than a > few copies. > > Which may well explain Chaosium's difficulties with Stormbringer/Elric! > over the years as apart from the original scenario books The Stealer of > Souls and The Black Sword, NONE of the published supplements have featured > Elric IIRC. Frankly however, I think they are the better for it. If the > fantasy setting is so weak it cannot hold the players and GM's interest > without wheeling on the characters from the fiction it is derived from then > it probably wasn't worth the effort adapting to an RPG in the first place > IMO... Agreed, but IMO that's the sensibility of an experienced RPGer. If one of the goals of a licensed situation is to attract players to RPG via their interest in the licensed materials then it's really a requirement to include the familiar characters and allow them as PCs to let newbie players get inside their favorites' heads. Seems to me that the most successful licensed-property-based RPGs have either included this as a primary element (Star Trek, Star Wars, Middle Earth) or have been of properties that were not strongly personality driven (CoC) so the expectation of playing particular individuals wasn't there. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From rico at ricosweb.com Fri Aug 6 02:34:42 2004 From: rico at ricosweb.com (Rich Allen) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 10:34:42 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <306750-2200484515521170@M2W088.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <200485103442.212739@laptop> On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 11:52:11 -0400, peter at maranci.net wrote: >?I'd LOVE to see the Floating Isles world that I've used (created a long >?time ago by a friend of mine, inspired by Yes album covers) published for >?BRP. A "world" composed of nothing but islands of rocks floating in endless >?blue sky is just the sort of unusual setting that's really refreshing. Do you have anything written up on this? My current campaign world is similar: the planet was blown apart by a spell gone wrong, but the wizards of the world had enough of a warning that they were able to negate most of the effects. The end result is large chunks of the planet as islands, large globes of ocean, lots of air between all orbiting a small, hot core. The "shattering" occured several thousand years before the current time, so the races have evolved to fit. Flying ships, new flying related spells and magic items, etc. (This is for D&D 3.5 but it would fit just about any game system). Rich Allen From leonbk at yahoo.com Fri Aug 6 03:47:36 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 10:47:36 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <200485103442.212739@laptop> Message-ID: <20040805174736.8342.qmail@web41102.mail.yahoo.com> --- Rich Allen wrote: > On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 11:52:11 -0400, peter at maranci.net > wrote: > A "world" composed of nothing but islands of > rocks floating in endless > >blue sky is just the sort of unusual setting > that's really refreshing. > > Do you have anything written up on this? My current > campaign world is similar: the planet was blown > apart by a spell gone wrong, but the wizards of the > world had enough of a warning that they were able to > negate most of the effects. The end result is large > chunks of the planet as islands, large globes of > ocean, lots of air between all orbiting a small, hot > core. The "shattering" occured several thousand > years before the current time, so the races have > evolved to fit. Flying ships, new flying related > spells and magic items, etc. (This is for D&D 3.5 > but it would fit just about any game system). If memory serves, there is/was a suppliment for the Stormbringer called the Rogue Misteress, where characters were travelling from one sphere/plane to another. One of the areas/planes they visited was a set of islands orbiting a central point just as you described above. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From peter at maranci.net Fri Aug 6 03:55:46 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 13:55:46 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Worlds for BRP Message-ID: <215930-22004845175546846@M2W067.mail2web.com> * Rich Allen rico at ricosweb.com wrote: > Do you have anything written up on this? My current campaign world is > similar: the planet was blown apart by a spell gone wrong, but the wizards > of the world had enough of a warning that they were able to negate most of > the effects. The end result is large chunks of the planet as islands, > large globes of ocean, lots of air between all orbiting a small, hot > core. The "shattering" occured several thousand years before the current > time, so the races have evolved to fit. Flying ships, new flying related > spells and magic items, etc. (This is for D&D 3.5 but it would fit just > about any game system). Sounds somewhat similar, but the Floating Isles never had an origin as such. It also had *no* standard race equivalents - no humans, dwarves, elves, etc., although there were roughly humanoid races - and featured a multitude of magic systems (magic tended to have been developed very differently from isle to isle) as well as an ecosystem which was pretty memorable; air whales, living clouds of fungus, and other bizarre stuff. I've run games in that setting quite a few times, but the only stuff I've posted online is in a PDF of an old zine: http://www.maranci.net/rr15.pdf ,starting on page 4. One of the things that I think drew a lot of people to Glorantha is that it broke the standard fantasy cliches. Unfortunately most FRPGS, as well as most modern fantasy literature, stick to the same old "elves dwarves hobbits save the world from the dark lord" stuff. That works if you're Tolkien, but otherwise it's hard to pull it off. There's so much potential *variety* in fantasy, but it's all almost totally ignored. Once in a while someone breaks through with something a bit different ("The Sixth Sense" is a good example, and it would make a hell of a game setting), but mostly people stick to the same boring old stuff. Frustrating! Ten years ago I tried to get my regular group to play in a new short-length campaign. It was going to use RQ mechanics, but they would be playing modern characters - themselves. They wanted to know more, so I finally told them that at the start of the game they would all be on a bus in Cambridge when there would be a crash, killing them all. The campaign would consist of their adventures in the afterlife, trying to understand their new environment and at the same time figure out why they had been (as it turned out) murdered. Over the next several days all but one of them decided that the campaign would be too strange for them. Mind you, I'd GMed several campaigns for these people already! But they wanted me to continue with more standard fare. Oh well. ->Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From rico at ricosweb.com Fri Aug 6 05:01:41 2004 From: rico at ricosweb.com (Rich Allen) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 13:01:41 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <20040805174736.8342.qmail@web41102.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20048513141.572683@laptop> On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 10:47:36 -0700 (PDT), Leon Kirshtein wrote: >?If memory serves, there is/was a suppliment for the >?Stormbringer called the Rogue Misteress, where >?characters were travelling from one sphere/plane to >?another. ?One of the areas/planes they visited was a >?set of islands orbiting a central point just as you >?described above. That sounds interesting, was there a lot of detail in the write up or just a few paragraphs? I might have to look that one up anyway. Rich Allen From rico at ricosweb.com Fri Aug 6 05:06:47 2004 From: rico at ricosweb.com (Rich Allen) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 13:06:47 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <215930-22004845175546846@M2W067.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <20048513647.011017@laptop> On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 13:55:46 -0400, peter at maranci.net wrote: >?One of the things that I think drew a lot of people to Glorantha is that it >?broke the standard fantasy cliches. Unfortunately most FRPGS, as well as >?most modern fantasy literature, stick to the same old "elves dwarves >?hobbits save the world from the dark lord" stuff. That works if you're >?Tolkien, but otherwise it's hard to pull it off. Well, that was the probably the biggest thing that turned my off of Glorantha! To each his own I guess! :) The races in my campaigns are all derived from the "standard" elves, dwarves, gnomes and humans. I don't particularly like halflings though, and the whole concept of half-breeds makes me laugh. I also give the races twists that I like to think make them a little more interesting to play. Rich Allen From leonbk at yahoo.com Fri Aug 6 05:24:03 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 12:24:03 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <215930-22004845175546846@M2W067.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <20040805192403.98663.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> --- "peter at maranci.net" wrote: >>It was going to use RQ mechanics, but they would be playing modern characters - themselves. I try something like this, but with Glorantha intruding into the modern world. Sort of like moder day Glorantha. I got about the same sort of a response as you did, from my players. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From leonbk at yahoo.com Fri Aug 6 05:25:19 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 12:25:19 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <20048513141.572683@laptop> Message-ID: <20040805192519.25997.qmail@web41113.mail.yahoo.com> --- Rich Allen wrote: One of the areas/planes they visited was > a > >set of islands orbiting a central point just as > you > >described above. > > That sounds interesting, was there a lot of detail > in the write up or just a few paragraphs? I might > have to look that one up anyway. I have it at home. I will refresh my mind and let you know later tonight. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From ffilz-lists at mindspring.com Fri Aug 6 05:24:52 2004 From: ffilz-lists at mindspring.com (Frank Filz) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 12:24:52 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP References: <306750-2200484515521170@M2W088.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <00d001c47b21$e8b54eb0$ce182f09@IBMSKFUWSTXPIP> > I'd LOVE to see the Floating Isles world that I've used (created a long > time ago by a friend of mine, inspired by Yes album covers) published for > BRP. A "world" composed of nothing but islands of rocks floating in endless > blue sky is just the sort of unusual setting that's really refreshing. Hmm, a Roger Dean world would definitely be cool. Frank From phil.hibbs at capgemini.com Fri Aug 6 05:26:56 2004 From: phil.hibbs at capgemini.com (Hibbs, Phil) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 20:26:56 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E981EC@exast02.capgemini.co.u k> Personally, I would like to see a David Gemmel "Legend" setting. I only read a couple of books, but I liked them. Lankhmar is cool, but is more suited to D&D, IMO. I've also had thoughts about converting the Birthright setting to RQ. It's the only cool D&D setting I've come across. I'm really hyped about the possibility of a Known Space BRP supplement, too. Phil Hibbs. Our name has changed. Please update your address book to the following format: "recipient at capgemini.com". This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. From ffilz-lists at mindspring.com Fri Aug 6 05:28:03 2004 From: ffilz-lists at mindspring.com (Frank Filz) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 12:28:03 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Worlds for BRP References: <20048513647.011017@laptop> Message-ID: <00d401c47b22$5432dae0$ce182f09@IBMSKFUWSTXPIP> > Well, that was the probably the biggest thing that turned my off of > Glorantha! To each his own I guess! :) The races in mycampaigns are all > derived from the "standard" elves, dwarves, gnomes and humans. I don't > particularly like halflings though, and the whole concept of half-breeds > makes me laugh. I also give the races twists that I like to think make > them a little more interesting to play. I have gotten tired of some of the same old same old, so Glorantha is attractive to me. What's nice also is that Glorantha doesn't go so far out that it's totally weird. I also dislike all the half-breed stuff (which has really exploded in D&D these days with half-this, half-that, half-the-other things [how you get three halves into one, I don't know...]). Frank From DevinC at aol.com Fri Aug 6 05:33:01 2004 From: DevinC at aol.com (DevinC at aol.com) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 15:33:01 EDT Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: <42.54bfe860.2e43e56d@aol.com> I will still state, despite reports of Ms. LeGuin's reticence, that Earthsea would make the best world for BRP. The whole tone of that world, somewhat calm....somewhat less fantastical, fits with BRP. Devin From nphillis at shaw.ca Fri Aug 6 06:04:51 2004 From: nphillis at shaw.ca (Newton Philis) Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 15:04:51 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: <3b305343b2b78d.3b2b78d3b30534@shaw.ca> Perhaps a 'Setting Search' like Wizards of the Coast did recently (but for RQ). > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From viktor.haag at gmail.com Fri Aug 6 07:20:09 2004 From: viktor.haag at gmail.com (Viktor Haag) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 17:20:09 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <3b305343b2b78d.3b2b78d3b30534@shaw.ca> References: <3b305343b2b78d.3b2b78d3b30534@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <1786319f0408051420722852a0@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 05 Aug 2004 15:04:51 -0500, Newton Philis wrote: > Perhaps a 'Setting Search' like Wizards of the Coast did recently (but for RQ). That's an excellent notion -- someone should definitely suggest that to Chaosium. However, I suspect first they need to have basic rulebooks in the water (i.e. proper published books to sell). From viktor.haag at gmail.com Fri Aug 6 07:23:45 2004 From: viktor.haag at gmail.com (Viktor Haag) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 17:23:45 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <42.54bfe860.2e43e56d@aol.com> References: <42.54bfe860.2e43e56d@aol.com> Message-ID: <1786319f0408051423779ef241@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 5 Aug 2004 15:33:01 EDT, devinc at aol.com wrote: > I will still state, despite reports of Ms. LeGuin's reticence, that Earthsea > would make the best world for BRP. The whole tone of that world, somewhat > calm....somewhat less fantastical, fits with BRP. With the right effort, it could be an interesting project. I know of a subscriber to Lee Gold's "Alarums and Excursions" APA that is currently adapting it for use, but I think he's using HeroQuest as the basis. Another good setting: Jack Vance's "Lyonesse" from the trilogy of the same name. A strange Swiss company managed to secure the rights to produce a rolegame in French for the setting. It's an absolutely marvelous book with LOTS of detail, but is of course written in French. When I got up the nerve to ask them about licensing it for an English translation, I found that they had presumably gone bankrupt with no net presence left whatsoever. Still, if anyone's interested, and can speak French, and lives in North America, you can probably still find copies of the game (at a reduced price) at Le Valet D'Coeur in Montreal (and they deal in internet orders, too). I think Lyonesse would adapt perfectly to Pendragon, but could also be a setting for good use with BRP. From katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com Fri Aug 6 07:37:14 2004 From: katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com (John Raner) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 14:37:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <20048513647.011017@laptop> Message-ID: <20040805213714.76257.qmail@web53702.mail.yahoo.com> --- Rich Allen wrote: > Well, that was the probably the biggest > thing that turned my off of Glorantha! To each his > own I guess! :) The races in my campaigns are all > derived from the "standard" elves, dwarves, gnomes > and humans. I don't particularly like halflings > though, and the whole concept of half-breeds makes > me laugh. I also give the races twists that I like > to think make them a little more interesting to > play. Too each his own I guess! :) I have always liked half-breeds... The idea of a race (orcs) which is fecund and can breed with most humanoid races appeals to me. Especially if said race is somewhat stupid, weak, etc. The half-breed might bring some of the advantages of the other parent into the tribal gene pool. Cheers, John ===== "Keep a government poor and weak and it's your servant; let it get rich and powerful and it's your master." ---- Colonel Andrew Jackson Hickok A state, is called the coldest of all cold monsters. Coldly lieth it also; and this lie creepeth from its mouth: "I, the state, am the people." ---- Friedrich Nietzsche "It is a shame that governments are chiefed by the devil tongues" ---- Chief Ten Bears "There is no such thing as an obsolete weapon or tool, merely obsolete thinking in its employ." ---- Mark D. (CapnCarp at yahoo.com) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From Michael.Christian at corbis.com Fri Aug 6 09:19:02 2004 From: Michael.Christian at corbis.com (Michael.Christian at corbis.com) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 16:19:02 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C7919274109420E6@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> I'm not so sure that I agree with Lankhmar being more suited to D&D, but most of the depictions of Lankhmar in art seem to be off as far as timeline goes (IMO). I recently reread the books and in a lot of ways they seem like they are more iron age than they are middle ages/high fantasy. Particularly at the point where Fafhrd and the Mouser cross over into (I believe) ancient Rome and don't even notice the difference. Lankhmarts all wear togas being another indicator. It also comes across as a low magic world (something D&D doesn't seem to do well) magic is ritualized, time consuming, feared by the common man, and when it works high powered. The floating worlds in Rogue Mistress are only given a bit of detail. A basic rundown on why things are that way and how it works, but that's about it. It does leave a lot of potential to be explored however, and indicates that great cultural differences exist between islands. -----Original Message----- From: rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com [mailto:rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com]On Behalf Of Hibbs, Phil Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 12:27 PM To: 'rq-rules at crashbox.com' Subject: RE: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Personally, I would like to see a David Gemmel "Legend" setting. I only read a couple of books, but I liked them. Lankhmar is cool, but is more suited to D&D, IMO. I've also had thoughts about converting the Birthright setting to RQ. It's the only cool D&D setting I've come across. I'm really hyped about the possibility of a Known Space BRP supplement, too. Phil Hibbs. Our name has changed. Please update your address book to the following format: "recipient at capgemini.com". This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From lancelot at inetnebr.com Fri Aug 6 10:06:11 2004 From: lancelot at inetnebr.com (lance dyas) Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 19:06:11 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Broomstix... In-Reply-To: <411238DB.8080703@talmeta.net> References: <411238DB.8080703@talmeta.net> Message-ID: <4112CB73.50704@inetnebr.com> Tal Meta wrote: > Nick.Middleton at invensys.com wrote: > >> But even if JKR was willing, would the expense and production overheads >> (approvals, limited artists etc) warrant the added sales, especially >> for a >> small outfit like Chaosium? Especially as, despite the hype, the "School >> for Wizards" schtick and all it's paraphernalia is neither original nor >> JKR's exclusive copy-right: a generic "trainee magicians" in a magical >> society that exists in parallel with but concealed from our own modern >> world is a perfectly doable supplement... in fact there may even be >> d20 one >> out already... > > > I haven't seen a d20 version, but there's a pdf floating around > cyberspace purporting to be "Broomstix: The Harry Potter RPG". Can be > found in the places where other RPG pdfs can be found lounging about, > one imagines... > > The system looks more like Space: 1889 than anything else, on a quick > perusal (I could be wrong; I just hunted it up to make sure it wasn't > d20 afterall...) > I have seen a quite decent GURPS adaption of Potter on the Web as well. -- Lance Dyas Lost Worlds Roleplaying - at the Decision Driven Gaming Center http://www.dyasdesigns.com/roleplay/LostWorlds From steve at perrinworlds.com Fri Aug 6 11:45:46 2004 From: steve at perrinworlds.com (Steve Perrin) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 18:45:46 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Worlds for BRP References: <20040805192403.98663.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <008101c47b57$2804c930$68417442@wizard> I've run a Fantasy Hero/Champions campaign with two different gaming groups that starts with a group of normal modern (well, I encouraged them to be competent in some things, not just common dweebs) coming into Heathrow Airport when there is an explosion and a voice comes into each ear saying "I can rescue from this, will you serve me?" As the plane starts to tailspin down, the characters have to take the chance and say yes (the second group took forever). They find themselves in a large circular room, every one of them mother-naked without a dead cell on their bodies (so they are bald and pink [or something] too). They see a man in robes suddenly collapse after saying a couple of mysterious worlds. It's the guy who brought them over, but he miscalculated the strain. It just killed him. The tower they are in is promptly invaded by nasty subterranean types. Left without any means of protecting themselves (no weapons on the walls of the room), they flee down a corridor, and each is drawn to a different door. The doors have strange runes on them. They enter and find themselves in situations where they are offered the chance to take up the mantle of a god that appeals to their various interests (which I have of course studied ahead of time). The gods are those of Glorantha. They step forth from the rooms as avatars of Orlanth and Chalana Arroy and Kyger Litor and various others. They beat up on the invaders, and find they are the smallest part of a gigantic invasion army. They have to work with the local authorities and fight off the invaders. The invaders I used were alien supervillain invaders from a Champions Invaders from Underneath scenario (that may be the title). The concept was taken in part from Barbara Hambly's first trilogy, though the bad guys are a lot more concrete than hers were. I used an old Chaosium map of Arthur's England for the campaign map. And if you looked off to the south and east, you could see a Red Moon in geo-synchronus orbit over what once was Carthage. Oh, and the stars showed that this Earth was in the same time as our modern one. Fun campaign. The first time I ran it Humakt was taken by a sword-trainer to the stars. The second time it was a black boxer in the Mohammed Ali mode. I suppose one of these days I should run a SPQR version... Steve Perrin All the Words You Need ----- Original Message ----- From: "Leon Kirshtein" To: ; "RuneQuest rules discussion." Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 12:24 PM Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: Worlds for BRP > --- "peter at maranci.net" wrote: > >>It was going to use RQ mechanics, but they would be > playing modern characters - themselves. > > I try something like this, but with Glorantha > intruding into the modern world. Sort of like moder > day Glorantha. I got about the same sort of a > response as you did, from my players. > > ===== > Leon Kirshtein > www.godlearner.d2g.com > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. > http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Fri Aug 6 17:47:05 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 08:47:05 +0100 Subject: Potter & JKR was Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. Message-ID: >lance dyas wrote: >> Nick.Middleton at invensys.com wrote: >> >>>> peter at maranci.net wrote: >>>> >>>> * Harry Potter? >>> >>> IIRC JK Rowling has indicated that this will happen over her dead body; >>> thus, more accurately, 70 years after her death... >>> >> I personally think this response of hers is due to a strong >> misunderstanding of roleplaying by a non-gamer. She has a strong >> sense of IP on her characters (which she is making hand over fist >> on), and somehow thinks a roleplaying game is giving others "permission >> to tell stories of her characters"???? > >That's certainly her prerogative, but unless she's got similarly strong >feelings about "fan fic" based on them, it sounds hypocritical to me. Not really. FanFic is what consenting adults get up to in their own homes, or discuss with like minded individuals in private fora, but no author has to take a blind bit of notice of any of it and those who dislike it or don't wish to know of it can avoid it easily. An "Official Harry Potter the Role Playing Game", properly licensed and approved, would _require_ her to endorse material by other writers as being part of her mythology - it would give other people a stake, however small, in her creation. I can see why on a personal basis she doesn't want to give anyone else that sort of access to her creation, whilst having no particular issue with fan-fic (which she can ignore at will). Cheers, Nick Middleton From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Fri Aug 6 17:49:18 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 08:49:18 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: >I'm not so sure that I agree with Lankhmar being more suited to D&D, but >most of the depictions of Lankhmar in art seem to be off as far as timeline >goes (IMO). I recently reread the books and in a lot of ways they seem like >they are more iron age than they are middle ages/high fantasy. Particularly >at the point where Fafhrd and the Mouser cross over into (I believe) ancient >Rome and don't even notice the difference. Lankhmarts all wear togas being >another indicator. It also comes across as a low magic world (something D&D >doesn't seem to do well) magic is ritualized, time consuming, feared by the >common man, and when it works high powered. I'd have to agree. Certainly reading the AD&D supplements tha t TSR did doesn't create a feel that matches well with the books - I always envisaged Lankhmar as more of a decadent Rome and whilst the weapons and such were quite "modern" in other respects it felt distinctly pre-medieval... Certainly I have always bought the TSR Lankhmar stuff on the assumption I'd run it with a different system (RQ or Dragon Warriors probably). >The floating worlds in Rogue Mistress are only given a bit of detail. A >basic rundown on why things are that way and how it works, but that's about >it. It does leave a lot of potential to be explored however, and indicates >that great cultural differences exist between islands. It's the setting for the first proper "scenario" isn't it, the rescue one? It's not the most memorable one IMO... I think that goes to Lawrence Whitaker's crashed "ship". But it's a cracking campaign, if a little epic and possible a bit linear. Another setting with floating islands (and probably the other inspiration for my Ulfland/Alberrazan 'continent' floating in the mists besides Niven's A Gift From Earth) is Skyrealms of Jorune, where portions of the landscape fairly regularly break away and wander across the world... Cheers, Nick Middleton From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Fri Aug 6 18:13:47 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 09:13:47 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: >On Thu, 05 Aug 2004 15:04:51 -0500, Newton Philis wrote: >> Perhaps a 'Setting Search' like Wizards of the Coast did recently (but for RQ). > >That's an excellent notion -- someone should definitely suggest that >to Chaosium. However, I suspect first they need to have basic >rulebooks in the water (i.e. proper published books to sell). Sadly, I don't think Chaosium can offer the sorts of terms that WotC did, nor have they got the resources to deal with the volume of entries that WotC's search generated (~11,000 for the single page first round IIRC...), and given the end product was Eberrron (who, me bitter that I'm one of the 10,989 who failed at the first hurdle? Nah...) Cynicism aside, I think this is an idea that has merit. I certainly think Chaosium should be looking to _new_ imaginative settings to spark peoples interests. Few license would have the market impact to make a huge difference, and most of those are too experience, too complex for Chaosium in their current form; and mostly (LotR, Star Wars, Star Trek, Buffy, Angel, Potter, Earthsea) already taken or off-limits. Of the remaining licenses, there is probably only single world book stuff left (as SJG do with GURPS), and again one stumbles on the hurdle of the license adding an overhead both immediately financial and in approval time that may make it uneconomical, especially for an outfit like Chaosium. As I argued earlier, I think a fresh setting (or settings), unimpeded by licensing overheads, would do Chaosium much better. Imagine something like the 2nd edition of Cthulhu by Gaslight, the CoC 1890's supplement. In a single volume it sketches a new setting for use with familiar rules (variants to Character generation, combat, magic etc), catches the high points of inspirational literature for the setting, outlines ideas for running the game and provides a solid extended scenario. Or Griffin Mountain - cultures, settings, scenarios and ideas that could sustain YEARS of play. The modern form would be Cthulhu Dark Ages (but as an Advanced BRP Supplement one would ONLY need the variants to the rules). THAT'S what I'd like to see Chaosium publish, and ideally several in different settings, only going back to a setting if it proved overwhelming popular... Hmm, I'm probably back at the Lottery winning thing again, aren't I? Cheers, Nick Middleton From viktor.haag at gmail.com Fri Aug 6 23:33:06 2004 From: viktor.haag at gmail.com (Viktor Haag) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 09:33:06 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1786319f040806063353353043@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 6 Aug 2004 09:13:47 +0100, nick.middleton at invensys.com wrote: > > Sadly, I don't think Chaosium can offer the sorts of terms that WotC did, Do you think they'd need to? For many, a small prize and a commitment to developing the world for publication might be enough, don't you think? > nor have they got the resources to deal with the volume of entries that > WotC's search generated (~11,000 for the single page first round IIRC...), I highly doubt they'd get the same volume of entries that WotC did. > and given the end product was Eberrron (who, me bitter that I'm one of the > 10,989 who failed at the first hurdle? Nah...) I suspect (and suspected) that the primary goal in the WotC contest was not to find a gameworld that was unique or fascinating or powerfully drawn. Rather it was to find the gameworld that, amongst the entrants, presented the greatest possibility for (a) merchantibility, and (b) great expandabilitiy. On simply those grounds, it seems to me that Ebberon shows great promise. I can't say that it particularly appeals to me personally, however, I must say that I can clearly see that it could be hugely popular with WotC's core audience (and stretch the popularity beyond that audience) and produce lots and lots of splatbooks. > Cynicism aside, I think this is an idea that has merit. I certainly think > Chaosium should be looking to _new_ imaginative settings to spark peoples > interests. I strongly agree. One of the MASSIVE drawbacks to Glorantha at this point, and it's quite evident in HeroQuest, is the large barrier to entry to non-gloranthaphiles. I believe that Greg and the others laboring with Issaries were painfully aware of this barrier to entry and the fact that the HeroQuest kick at the can, following swiftly on the heels of the HeroWars dry run, is evidence at just how difficult it is to overcome this barrier. I'm beginning to suspect it may not be possible to overcome. I will be *very* interested in seeing how Guardians of Order address this issue with the Tekumel game that's vastly overdue and supposedly now just around the corner of publication. Realistically, I can't see that it will be any more successful at grabbing new fans for Tekumel than already exist (or at least not in large numbers), but I could be wrong. Where am I going with this? Well, I think there's tremendous utility at being in at the ground floor of one of these massive world building projects. What newcomers to D20 have tackled the Forgotten Realms? I think this is the real reason behind Eberron: WotC needs to hook an entirely new generation of gamers with a gameworld that will pay dividends for them ten years from now, as FR has done over the years. And retooling FR for 3.x hasn't done the job. For BRP to survive as a long term engine, I think it needs either (a) a constant stream of inexpensive setting adaptations, a la Steve Jackson, or (b) a constant stream of well-written adventures and campaigns built on a well-framed but flexible game world. The latter is what has kept CoC alive for all these years, the former is what built SJG into the stable company it is today. Sadly, (b) requires a core group of enormously talented and creative folks, and I'm not sure that at this point Chaosium has the ability to marshall them. (a) merely requires a large number of people willing to adapt their favourite settings/historical periods to a new set of mechanics, and it's much easier to find those folks. > As I argued earlier, I think a fresh setting (or settings), unimpeded by > licensing overheads, would do Chaosium much better. Imagine something like > the 2nd edition of Cthulhu by Gaslight, the CoC 1890's supplement. In a > single volume it sketches a new setting for use with familiar rules > (variants to Character generation, combat, magic etc), catches the high > points of inspirational literature for the setting, outlines ideas for > running the game and provides a solid extended scenario. Or Griffin > Mountain - cultures, settings, scenarios and ideas that could sustain YEARS > of play. The modern form would be Cthulhu Dark Ages (but as an Advanced BRP > Supplement one would ONLY need the variants to the rules). > > THAT'S what I'd like to see Chaosium publish, and ideally several in > different settings, only going back to a setting if it proved overwhelming > popular... I agree with you entirely, Nick. > Hmm, I'm probably back at the Lottery winning thing again, aren't I? Not necessarily. I think this plan can could easily succeed, especially in the world of PDF publishing we seem to be entering. What Chaosium needs to do is secure material from freelancers, and be open to givnig those people a place to publish their work. They seem to have taken steps in that direction with their notion of publishing monographs. But I think their technology has bungled in at least one area: not giving the product at least the illusion of always being in print. If you can't bring the product costs for a monograph to a point where you can effecitvely perpetually keep the product in print (where the cover cost always justifies printing at least 10 or 20 copies to keep in inventory, say?), then what's the point of the monograph concept anyway? I'm surprised that Chaosium's monograph series hasn't been done in PDF. The future in gaming seems to be in selling two types of products (a) long lasting durables in the form of main rulebooks and main supplements (i.e. the Dreamlands hb), and (b) inexpensive, short, cheap support material in PDF (adventures, equipment collections, crunchy add ons and options). Area (b) is where you want to locate, groom, and train freelancers, I should think. Anyway, I'm just tossing off ideas here, and haven't yet had my morning coffee, so I'll shut up now. -- Viktor From gianni at basicrps.com Fri Aug 6 23:10:20 2004 From: gianni at basicrps.com (Gianni) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 15:10:20 +0200 Subject: Potter & JKR was Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1091797820.4113833c9e998@imp.webhuset.no> Quoting Nick.Middleton at invensys.com: > FanFic is what consenting adults get up to in their own homes <...> > An "Official Harry Potter the > Role Playing Game", properly licensed and approved, would _require_ her to > endorse material by other writers as being part of her mythology I agree. The reason Glorantha appeals to me, I think, is because Greg Stafford is a rolegamer himself. Usually, I find licensed gaming worlds extremely dull. Why would you explore the Shire when you know you could be saving the world? ;-) G. From leonbk at yahoo.com Sat Aug 7 00:10:43 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 07:10:43 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Potter & JKR was Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQ Status. In-Reply-To: <1091797820.4113833c9e998@imp.webhuset.no> Message-ID: <20040806141043.55404.qmail@web41107.mail.yahoo.com> > I agree. The reason Glorantha appeals to me, I > think, is because Greg Stafford is a rolegamer himself. That is the problem as well. I found that it supresses others in developing the setting. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From nphillis at shaw.ca Sat Aug 7 00:07:03 2004 From: nphillis at shaw.ca (Newton Philis) Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 09:07:03 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: <3bc1b703bbf308.3bbf3083bc1b70@shaw.ca> > Do you think they'd need to WotC did>? For many, a small prize and a commitment > to developing the world for publication might be enough, don't you > think? I agree. RQ has such a devout following, I do not think a huge cash reward is necessary. > > nor have they got the resources to deal with the volume of > entries that > > WotC's search generated (~11,000 for the single page first > round IIRC...), > > I suspect (and suspected) that the primary goal in the WotC contest > was not to find a gameworld that was unique or fascinating or > powerfully drawn. Rather it was to find the gameworld that presented the greatest possibility for (a) > merchantibility, and (b) great expandabilitiy. This is where I think Chaosium can do better than WotC: when the entries are narrowed down (by Chaosium) to the final 10-20 entries, then put the 1-page write-ups on their site and ask for the fans to vote for the best entry. This way at least every fan of RQ feels they had a 'say' in the primary world of publication. > Where am I going with this? Well, I think there's tremendous utility > at being in at the ground floor of one of these massive world building > projects. I think this is the real reason behind Eberron: WotC needs to hook an > entirely new generation of gamers with a gameworld. I totally agree. Hopefully, a 'Setting Search' can help provide everything you mentioned above. From peter at maranci.net Sat Aug 7 00:31:03 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 10:31:03 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: <91380-2200485614313457@M2W077.mail2web.com> Is a primary world necessary? I was thinking that a set of original worlds might be better. That way you'd also avoid the Greg Trap, i.e. having the entire system tied to the creative control of a single individual. The different worlds could be linked by an expanded version of CoC's Dreamlands, which could also stand in place of the GodTime for those who miss that part of Glorantha. I realize that there might be issues in connecting SF and really outre universes to the Dreamlands, though. ->Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From pare_jf at hotmail.com Sat Aug 7 00:25:22 2004 From: pare_jf at hotmail.com (John Pare) Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 14:25:22 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question Message-ID: Hi, I have on the list for some time, and I was just wondering how many players are from the USA. I have lived in Europe, and it seemed to be much more popular there, though I try my hardest to gain more interest here.. Thanks John From leonbk at yahoo.com Sat Aug 7 00:45:34 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 07:45:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <91380-2200485614313457@M2W077.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <20040806144534.30005.qmail@web41109.mail.yahoo.com> --- "peter at maranci.net" wrote: > Is a primary world necessary? I was thinking that a > set of original worlds > might be better. That way you'd also avoid the Greg > Trap, i.e. having the > entire system tied to the creative control of a > single individual. > > The different worlds could be linked by an expanded > version of CoC's > Dreamlands, which could also stand in place of the > GodTime for those who > miss that part of Glorantha. I realize that there > might be issues in > connecting SF and really outre universes to the > Dreamlands, though. I actually think that Stombringer is better suited for this. It already has a Multiuniverse and the current rules are mostly BFR anyway. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Sat Aug 7 01:26:37 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 16:26:37 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: >On Fri, 6 Aug 2004 09:13:47 +0100, nick.middleton at invensys.com > wrote: >> >> Sadly, I don't think Chaosium can offer the sorts of terms that WotC did, > >Do you think they'd need to? For many, a small prize and a commitment >to developing the world for publication might be enough, don't you >think? Well, _all_ the rights (game, fiction in all forms, action s figures etc etc) to Eberron (and the second and third placed submissions) now belong to WotC in perpetuity, so yes, if Chaosium are going to go after the same sort of deal actually they need to offer something on the same order of magnitude... Which is a round about way of suggesting that Chaosium would have to do something "similar but different" I suppose... >> nor have they got the resources to deal with the volume of entries that >> WotC's search generated (~11,000 for the single page first round IIRC...), > >I highly doubt they'd get the same volume of entries that WotC did. But banking on that doubt could make them look very stupid and at worst cripple them. Again, I don't think the WotC model scales well to Chaosium's needs and stature - they need to raise the entry bar, so the field of entrants is self-selecting to a greater extent. >> and given the end product was Eberrron (who, me bitter that I'm one of the >> 10,989 who failed at the first hurdle? Nah...) > >I suspect (and suspected) that the primary goal in the WotC contest >was not to find a gameworld that was unique or fascinating or >powerfully drawn. Rather it was to find the gameworld that, amongst >the entrants, presented the greatest possibility for (a) >merchantibility, and (b) great expandabilitiy. Being a cynic, I think it was a marketing exercise to a) hype up their next setting launch as Ha$bro were breathing down their necks and b) put the in-house RPG R&D people in their place AND head off any of the unpleasantness they have had over previous games settings (Greyhawk, Forgotten Realms, Athas) by ensuring that they own it. > On simply those >grounds, it seems to me that Ebberon shows great promise. I can't say >that it particularly appeals to me personally, however, I must say >that I can clearly see that it could be hugely popular with WotC's >core audience (and stretch the popularity beyond that audience) and >produce lots and lots of splatbooks. To be honest, I suspect the plan for Eberron is built around it petering out by 2007 - as I suspect the business is something like D&D 4.0 for 2006 and the winner of the next setting search (launched late 2005) in 2007, as the only way that WotC can keep Ha$bro happy is by apply their tactics an re-differentiating the product every few years... >> Cynicism aside, I think this is an idea that has merit. I certainly think >> Chaosium should be looking to _new_ imaginative settings to spark peoples >> interests. > >I strongly agree. One of the MASSIVE drawbacks to Glorantha at this >point, and it's quite evident in HeroQuest, is the large barrier to >entry to non-gloranthaphiles. I believe that Greg and the others >laboring with Issaries were painfully aware of this barrier to entry >and the fact that the HeroQuest kick at the can, following swiftly on >the heels of the HeroWars dry run, is evidence at just how difficult >it is to overcome this barrier. I'm beginning to suspect it may not be >possible to overcome. > The problem is two fold I think - Gloranth is both a rich world (there is a lot of material) and an intricate world (the fine details of the cultures are quite involved and actually part of the appeal). If it was still possible to, for example, run a game in Loskalm that looked like a 1950's take on Ivanhoe without the nagging suspicion that one was doing a huge disservice to the lavish intricacies of Malkioni culture, I think Glorantha would sell like hot-cakes. But wherever one steps in Glorantha, SOMEONE else has already been there and written copious notes about it... sometimes even interestingly but there is now just too much of it. >I will be *very* interested in seeing how Guardians of Order address >this issue with the Tekumel game that's vastly overdue and supposedly >now just around the corner of publication. Realistically, I can't see >that it will be any more successful at grabbing new fans for Tekumel >than already exist (or at least not in large numbers), but I could be >wrong. One hopes they will take their cue from Professor Barker who, whilst delighting in his subcreation, has always seemed in what I have read to push very heavily the idea of gamers making Tekumel their own and who (partly because of the settings erratic and troubled printing history) never swamped it with the sort of exhaustive over analysis that plagues Glorantha: Tekumel is "weird" and "hard to get into", but that's in part because NONE of it's features are familiar to Westerners (where as Glorantha is full of booby-traps because of the passing surface resemblances...). >Where am I going with this? Well, I think there's tremendous utility >at being in at the ground floor of one of these massive world building >projects. What newcomers to D20 have tackled the Forgotten Realms? I >think this is the real reason behind Eberron: WotC needs to hook an >entirely new generation of gamers with a gameworld that will pay >dividends for them ten years from now, as FR has done over the years. >And retooling FR for 3.x hasn't done the job. Indeed, but it's a flawed strategy, as it simply locks a new generation in to the new world, so unless on e is going the Games Workshop (*spit*) route and ASSUMING ones target market will be buying for 3-5 years and then going elsewhere you will have the same problem in a few years. >For BRP to survive as a long term engine, I think it needs either (a) >a constant stream of inexpensive setting adaptations, a la Steve >Jackson, or (b) a constant stream of well-written adventures and >campaigns built on a well-framed but flexible game world. The latter >is what has kept CoC alive for all these years, the former is what >built SJG into the stable company it is today. I favour a), with the caveats that Chaoisum be deeply cautious of licenses and that they focus and publishing books that enable people to PLAY. Too many GURPS books, well researched though they are, leave one going"So what do I do know?". I know I bang on about this but "Griffin Mountain" - places, people, encounters, ideas. THAT'S what I need to pull off the shelf to kick start a game. So an Island, a region of space, a fortress at the cross roads between worlds... A guidebook to pre-fireamrs warfare with no, low levels and high levels of magic... >Sadly, (b) requires a core group of enormously talented and creative >folks, and I'm not sure that at this point Chaosium has the ability to >marshall them. (a) merely requires a large number of people willing to >adapt their favourite settings/historical periods to a new set of >mechanics, and it's much easier to find those folks. As I said, I think b) would just defer the problem for a couple of years... So I think they don't do a setting search - the do a call for BRP Supplements. Entering gives Chaosium the rights to the RPG supplement _only_ (so authors retain rights to characters and to publish novels etc), they give a reasonable detailed spec and the submissions must be say twenty page outlines of which Chaosium commit to publishing the best three in full form and the rest of the top say ten get posted at Chaosium's website... > >> Hmm, I'm probably back at the Lottery winning thing again, aren't I? > >Not necessarily. I think this plan can could easily succeed, >especially in the world of PDF publishing we seem to be entering. What >Chaosium needs to do is secure material from freelancers, and be open >to givnig those people a place to publish their work. They seem to >have taken steps in that direction with their notion of publishing >monographs. But I think their technology has bungled in at least one >area: not giving the product at least the illusion of always being in >print. If you can't bring the product costs for a monograph to a point >where you can effecitvely perpetually keep the product in print (where >the cover cost always justifies printing at least 10 or 20 copies to >keep in inventory, say?), then what's the point of the monograph >concept anyway? I'm surprised that Chaosium's monograph series hasn't >been done in PDF. As far as I can tell, it is the piracy issue plus the fact that they get ALL the income from the monographs. If DriveThru works, they may warm to PDF, (albeit I loathe Adobe's DRM)... >The future in gaming seems to be in selling two types of products (a) >long lasting durables in the form of main rulebooks and main >supplements (i.e. the Dreamlands hb), and (b) inexpensive, short, >cheap support material in PDF (adventures, equipment collections, >crunchy add ons and options). Area (b) is where you want to locate, >groom, and train freelancers, I should think. Indeed - look at what QuickLink Interactive have achieved with their Traveller's Aides and EPIC adventures fro Traveller. If I _did_ win the lottery, I'd be tempted to get a license from Chaosium and set up as a PDF only publisher on those lines... >Anyway, I'm just tossing off ideas here, and haven't yet had my >morning coffee, so I'll shut up now. Whereas I'm abusing my work Internet access after hours and really MUST go a and pick the kids up from childcare! Cheers, Nick Middleton From freyrvanic at earthlink.net Sat Aug 7 01:51:55 2004 From: freyrvanic at earthlink.net (Sven Lugar) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 08:51:55 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question Message-ID: <410-22004856155155437@earthlink.net> I'm originally a Hoosier, but now live in California. RQ Once again proving that Europe is more culturally advanced than the U.S. LOL > [Original Message] > From: John Pare > To: > Date: 8/6/2004 7:25:22 AM > Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question > > Hi, I have on the list for some time, and I was just wondering how many > players are from the USA. I have lived in Europe, and it seemed to be much > more popular there, though I try my hardest to gain more interest here.. > > Thanks > > John > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From gkahla at chromebob.com Sat Aug 7 03:05:00 2004 From: gkahla at chromebob.com (Gerall Kahla) Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 12:05:00 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <1786319f040806063353353043@mail.gmail.com> References: <1786319f040806063353353043@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4113BA3C.7090105@chromebob.com> Viktor Haag wrote: [snip] > Do you think they'd need to? For many, a small prize and a commitment > to developing the world for publication might be enough, don't you > think? i certainly wouldn't expect huge reimbursement; Chaosium just doesn't have money. i *would* be interested in having them build on top of any world or concept i put forward... [big-ole-snip] > Where am I going with this? Well, I think there's tremendous utility > at being in at the ground floor of one of these massive world building > projects. What newcomers to D20 have tackled the Forgotten Realms? I > think this is the real reason behind Eberron: WotC needs to hook an > entirely new generation of gamers with a gameworld that will pay > dividends for them ten years from now, as FR has done over the years. > And retooling FR for 3.x hasn't done the job. what you're describing here is the evolution of the art. roleplaying is a dynamic, growing thing. new gamers definitely need to feel connected to the realms they wander - treading the oft-worn trails of Greyhawk or FR [or Glorantha] doesn't excite as much as exploring totally new places. you cut straight to the chase with your observation about WotC needing a new hook. so does Chaosium! a new tide of BRP players will need new material to consume... > For BRP to survive as a long term engine, I think it needs either (a) > a constant stream of inexpensive setting adaptations, a la Steve > Jackson, or (b) a constant stream of well-written adventures and > campaigns built on a well-framed but flexible game world. The latter > is what has kept CoC alive for all these years, the former is what > built SJG into the stable company it is today. > > Sadly, (b) requires a core group of enormously talented and creative > folks, and I'm not sure that at this point Chaosium has the ability to > marshall them. (a) merely requires a large number of people willing to > adapt their favourite settings/historical periods to a new set of > mechanics, and it's much easier to find those folks. i don't know if i agree with you that your (b) option is unviable; if enough people give them freelance submissions of quality, they will have at least 3 or 4 worlds to grow roots in. between the brpsystem list and rq-rules, i've read of some *fantastic* environments to play in. really, we'd just need some serious effort put into writing them up and having someone proof them out. that's where Chaosium comes in... having the experience at publishing gaming material, their only challenge would be to keep their minds open about new settings and environments. [snippage] >>Or Griffin >>Mountain - cultures, settings, scenarios and ideas that could sustain YEARS >>of play. The modern form would be Cthulhu Dark Ages (but as an Advanced BRP >>Supplement one would ONLY need the variants to the rules). Nick - you're onto something here! there should be enough detail so that an environment feels unique without drowning out possible expansion by referees at home who'd like to tinker... excellent observations! >>THAT'S what I'd like to see Chaosium publish, and ideally several in >>different settings, only going back to a setting if it proved overwhelming >>popular... > > > I agree with you entirely, Nick. add another vote to Nick's concept. [snippin'] > Not necessarily. I think this plan can could easily succeed, > especially in the world of PDF publishing we seem to be entering. What > Chaosium needs to do is secure material from freelancers, and be open > to givnig those people a place to publish their work. They seem to > have taken steps in that direction with their notion of publishing > monographs. But I think their technology has bungled in at least one > area: not giving the product at least the illusion of always being in > print. If you can't bring the product costs for a monograph to a point > where you can effecitvely perpetually keep the product in print (where > the cover cost always justifies printing at least 10 or 20 copies to > keep in inventory, say?), then what's the point of the monograph > concept anyway? I'm surprised that Chaosium's monograph series hasn't > been done in PDF. the problem with electronic publication is that there's exceptionally little money in it. i wish people were more honest about re-imbursing the companies that produce PDFs, but the sad truth is that the nature of the medium means it's infinitely copyable without loss of fidelity. once the first copy is sold and downloaded, it can be shared on the Internet. realistically, companies can only expect one (1) copy to be legitimately SOLD. WotC releases PDFs for free from their website, then collects them together after they reach some thematic point of critical mass. let's say you get enough quality submissions for a magic supplement. there's already an audience [the people who downloaded the stuff to begin with]; most gamers i know like having treeware in their hands instead of PDFs. why not bind them up nicely for a 'magic supplement'? letting the material collect until there's enough to print up seems like a good idea to me. > The future in gaming seems to be in selling two types of products (a) > long lasting durables in the form of main rulebooks and main > supplements (i.e. the Dreamlands hb), and (b) inexpensive, short, > cheap support material in PDF (adventures, equipment collections, > crunchy add ons and options). Area (b) is where you want to locate, > groom, and train freelancers, I should think. anyone else have any observations about the gaming market? feel free to email me privately, if it's too OT for the list anymore... i'm planning on polishing up a world or two for submission when Chaosium gets their new BRP submission guidelines together. with any luck, Chaosium will have several options in the near future. happy gaming! -- Gerall Kahla -- the Celestial Mechanic [http://chromebob.com/] From slposey at concentric.net Sat Aug 7 02:46:59 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 09:46:59 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <4113BA3C.7090105@chromebob.com> References: <1786319f040806063353353043@mail.gmail.com> <4113BA3C.7090105@chromebob.com> Message-ID: <4113B603.70909@concentric.net> Gerall Kahla wrote: > > Viktor Haag wrote: > [snip] > >> Do you think they'd need to? For many, a small prize and a commitment >> to developing the world for publication might be enough, don't you >> think? > > > i certainly wouldn't expect huge reimbursement; Chaosium just doesn't > have money. i *would* be interested in having them build on top of any > world or concept i put forward... > > [big-ole-snip] > >> Where am I going with this? Well, I think there's tremendous utility >> at being in at the ground floor of one of these massive world building >> projects. What newcomers to D20 have tackled the Forgotten Realms? I >> think this is the real reason behind Eberron: WotC needs to hook an >> entirely new generation of gamers with a gameworld that will pay >> dividends for them ten years from now, as FR has done over the years. >> And retooling FR for 3.x hasn't done the job. > > what you're describing here is the evolution of the art. roleplaying is > a dynamic, growing thing. new gamers definitely need to feel connected > to the realms they wander - treading the oft-worn trails of Greyhawk or > FR [or Glorantha] doesn't excite as much as exploring totally new places. > > you cut straight to the chase with your observation about WotC needing a > new hook. so does Chaosium! a new tide of BRP players will need new > material to consume... Excellent observation. I don't think we can expect younger gamers (as a whole) to necessarily be "turned on" by the same things we were starting out in RPG (here I'm assuming most folks on this list have been playing at least 10 years or so, am I wrong?) What appeals to the younger set in RPG now? Looking around it appears that more dark-toned, gritty, "-punky" (whether cyber-, steam- or otherwise) atmosphere seems to be what everyone is doing, that's probably not an accident. >> For BRP to survive as a long term engine, I think it needs either (a) >> a constant stream of inexpensive setting adaptations, a la Steve >> Jackson, or (b) a constant stream of well-written adventures and >> campaigns built on a well-framed but flexible game world. The latter >> is what has kept CoC alive for all these years, the former is what >> built SJG into the stable company it is today. >> >> Sadly, (b) requires a core group of enormously talented and creative >> folks, and I'm not sure that at this point Chaosium has the ability to >> marshall them. (a) merely requires a large number of people willing to >> adapt their favourite settings/historical periods to a new set of >> mechanics, and it's much easier to find those folks. > > i don't know if i agree with you that your (b) option is unviable; if > enough people give them freelance submissions of quality, they will have > at least 3 or 4 worlds to grow roots in. between the brpsystem list and > rq-rules, i've read of some *fantastic* environments to play in. > really, we'd just need some serious effort put into writing them up and > having someone proof them out. that's where Chaosium comes in... > > having the experience at publishing gaming material, their only > challenge would be to keep their minds open about new settings and > environments. This is all precisely why I want Chaosium to "open" the system in some fashion: so that materials can be created without it necessarily having to pass by their (rather limited) eyes and hands. I understand all the "Quality" arguments, so I wouldn't necessarily make it as open as the OGL; but conversely it seems to me the current channel is just too narrow, isn't there some kind of happy medium? >>> Or Griffin >>> Mountain - cultures, settings, scenarios and ideas that could sustain >>> YEARS >>> of play. The modern form would be Cthulhu Dark Ages (but as an >>> Advanced BRP >>> Supplement one would ONLY need the variants to the rules). > > Nick - you're onto something here! there should be enough detail so > that an environment feels unique without drowning out possible expansion > by referees at home who'd like to tinker... excellent observations! Chaosium also has everything they did for RQ/Gateway way back when. Only Questworld and the Bestiary actually saw publication of course; but when they halted Gateway I feel sure they must have had other stuff in the pipeline that's just been languishing lo these many years. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From slposey at concentric.net Sat Aug 7 02:47:53 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 09:47:53 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4113B639.8030404@concentric.net> John Pare wrote: > Hi, I have on the list for some time, and I was just wondering how many > players are from the USA. I have lived in Europe, and it seemed to be > much more popular there, though I try my hardest to gain more interest > here.. I'm in the US, Las Vegas to be precise. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From DevinC at aol.com Sat Aug 7 02:55:36 2004 From: DevinC at aol.com (DevinC at aol.com) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 12:55:36 EDT Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: <83.1283864b.2e451208@aol.com> I think Glorantha could be introduced to a new generation of gamers if the entire atmosphere surrounding it were not so hostile to the new gamer. Much of the new material assumes a general knowledge of all things Glorantha, and the culture of Glorantha has become hostile to the idea of casual gaming within the world. Glorantha at the time of Cults of Prax was very friendly to new gamers. You could have a Yelmalian travel around with a Humakti Duck and a Stormbull Bison Rider and no one would look down on you. Now, though, you'd earn the emnity of every serious Glorantha-phile if you mentioned such a thing. Glorantha has sadly become the grounds for scholars rather than gamers. But the core of the world, the magic of it that originally enticed a lot of new gamers in the 70's and 80's is still there. It could theoretically be resurrected, but it would require an immense paragidm shift from its current devotees and would risk alienating its lingering core audience. Also, HQ and HW are extremely difficult game systems for a new GM to master. They really are. They are un-intuitive and place a great burden on the GM and players to fill in the blanks and flesh out the rules. BRP is on the other hand, extremely easy to get into and very easy to master. In other words, I think if: 1. BRP were reinstated as the official system of Glorantha 2. If it were supported with a lot of nice crunchy usable supplements (yes, that means gods, magic items, monsters, and scenarios) [along with the current fleshy bits like a 200 page tome describing the hemlines of Second Age Malkioni noblewomen] It could be embraced by newcomers. Devin From viktor.haag at gmail.com Sat Aug 7 03:35:25 2004 From: viktor.haag at gmail.com (Viktor Haag) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 13:35:25 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <4113BA3C.7090105@chromebob.com> References: <1786319f040806063353353043@mail.gmail.com> <4113BA3C.7090105@chromebob.com> Message-ID: <1786319f04080610355e0f3e4f@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 06 Aug 2004 12:05:00 -0500, Gerall Kahla wrote: > > the problem with electronic publication is that there's exceptionally > little money in it. i wish people were more honest about re-imbursing > the companies that produce PDFs, but the sad truth is that the nature > of the medium means it's infinitely copyable without loss of fidelity. > once the first copy is sold and downloaded, it can be shared on the > Internet. realistically, companies can only expect one (1) copy to be > legitimately SOLD. My understanding is that the sales data just doesn't bear these commonly held opinions out. I don't run an e-books store, or benefit from the sales of publishing e-books. However, I have heard people debate on both sides of this argument for a number of years now, and I'm inclined to lean towards the argument in favour of e-publishing. If e-books are attractively priced, and well marketed, it wouldn't surprise me at all that they could make money. I'm sure that the "up-side" may not be as high as selling hardcopy books, but then the overhead isn't nearly as large either. Material can be kept indefinitely in print (which is good for publishers, and maybe not so good for authors, but in the RPG market, I don't think the same problems vis a vis on-demand content arise as do in the traditional publishing world); projects that would plainly just fail as printed material can be mounted (buck-a-throw adventures, massive 500-page campaign guides); always-available material can "up-sell" subsequent material much more effectively (i.e. lots of people won't buy Adventure Module C, unless they can reliably get their hands on A and B: e-publishing makes this much more effective). I think it's still a bit too early to tell whether e-publishing is doable for the gaming industry long term. However, I can think of a number of publishers that seem to have incorporated it as part of their core business strategy. It'll be interesting to see where those publishers are in a year, two years, five years, etc. (The ones that leap immediately to mind are Iron Crown, QuickLink Interactive, and BTRC.) Adventure material has traditional been a real money-loser for traditional gaming publishers, I understand, but I'm convinced having *something* of this material is vital to keeping your game in play and thus selling the stuff that *does* make money (core books). However, e-publishing may very well remove all the financial "down-side" to publishing adventure material and keep most of the up-side. > anyone else have any observations about the gaming market? feel free > to email me privately, if it's too OT for the list anymore... Agreed -- it'd be nice to see discussion here in the open, but if it's too off-topic, please keep me in the CC loop as well... -- Viktor From viktor.haag at gmail.com Sat Aug 7 03:45:35 2004 From: viktor.haag at gmail.com (Viktor Haag) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 13:45:35 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <83.1283864b.2e451208@aol.com> References: <83.1283864b.2e451208@aol.com> Message-ID: <1786319f04080610451c150ceb@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 6 Aug 2004 12:55:36 EDT, devinc at aol.com wrote: > > But the core of the world, the magic of it that originally enticed a lot of > new gamers in the 70's and 80's is still there. It could theoretically be > resurrected, but it would require an immense paragidm shift from its current > devotees and would risk alienating its lingering core audience. I agree with you points Devin, however, I fear that I doubt that an established world like this can effectively be "re-presented" to a new audience. At least, I have yet to see this happen successfully in the gaming hobby. And a number of people have tried, with yet more trying. I think publishers see this as a "holy grail" of the hobby because if they can tap a new market for an old world, they have acres of old stuff they can draw upon for material. > Also, HQ and HW are extremely difficult game systems for a new GM to master. > They really are. They are un-intuitive and place a great burden on the GM > and players to fill in the blanks and flesh out the rules. BRP is on the other > hand, extremely easy to get into and very easy to master. I only agree with this in a qualified fashion. I was completely confused by HW and then attended Gloranthacon (it was local to me, otherwise I wouldn't have), where I was lucky enough to be able to talk to the people behind HQ and to actually play a brief session run by Stafford himself. This helped me IMMENSELY in understanding how the was "meant to be played". Neither HQ nor HW are all that complex objectively; what they are, though is relatively unapproachable. Once you're shown what to DO with HQ from someone in the know, it becomes much easier to weild the tool yourself. I ran a reasonably successful HQ campaign, set in Glorantha, with a table of complete newbies (to both the game and the setting, and in one case, to roleplaying in general). In the end the campaign finished because I think I'd painted myself into a bit of a box, and because of outside time pressures. The game itself was quite playable. But you're totally right that the setting demands "engagement" as it has been presented by Issaries; especially if you want to play in the new defacto setting of Dragon Pass. In that respect, it's rather like Pendragon. > 2. If it were supported with a lot of nice crunchy usable supplements (yes, > that means gods, magic items, monsters, and scenarios) [along with the > current fleshy bits like a 200 page tome describing the hemlines of Second Age > Malkioni noblewomen] Well, realize that Chaoisum will likely never get BRP anywhere near Glorantha ever again. So, I suppose what your second comment means is detailed cultural material like the Malkioni hemlines. > It could be embraced by newcomers. Perhaps. I still wonder whether gaming hasn't still ground itself down, rather like Wargaming did in the early to mid eighties. Are young, new people coming to the hobby? Do we have data to support this? Or is it still the same old core audience with slight growth and slightly larger contraction happening over a long period of time? I'm inclined to believe it's the latter until presented with hard data that WotC's sales are in fact going to more people. And the fact that "more sales" are happening than 15 years ago isn't necessarily convincing. I, for one, have more disposable income now than I did then, and my gaming purchases now are HUGELY more than they were then... - Viktor From carpgachair at yahoo.com Sat Aug 7 06:23:42 2004 From: carpgachair at yahoo.com (Paul Cardwell) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 13:23:42 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <1786319f04080610355e0f3e4f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20040806202342.58099.qmail@web51309.mail.yahoo.com> --- Viktor Haag wrote: > My understanding is that the sales data just doesn't > bear these > commonly held opinions out. I don't run an e-books > store, or benefit > from the sales of publishing e-books. However, I > have heard people > debate on both sides of this argument for a number > of years now, and > I'm inclined to lean towards the argument in favour > of e-publishing. > If e-books are attractively priced, and well > marketed, it wouldn't > surprise me at all that they could make money. > > I'm sure that the "up-side" may not be as high as > selling hardcopy > books, but then the overhead isn't nearly as large > either. > > Material can be kept indefinitely in print (which is > good for > publishers, and maybe not so good for authors, but > in the RPG market, > I don't think the same problems vis a vis on-demand > content arise as > do in the traditional publishing world); projects > that would plainly > just fail as printed material can be mounted > (buck-a-throw adventures, > massive 500-page campaign guides); always-available > material can > "up-sell" subsequent material much more effectively > (i.e. lots of > people won't buy Adventure Module C, unless they can > reliably get > their hands on A and B: e-publishing makes this much > more effective). > > I think it's still a bit too early to tell whether > e-publishing is > doable for the gaming industry long term. However, I > can think of a > number of publishers that seem to have incorporated > it as part of > their core business strategy. It'll be interesting > to see where those > publishers are in a year, two years, five years, > etc. (The ones that > leap immediately to mind are Iron Crown, QuickLink > Interactive, and > BTRC.) > > Adventure material has traditional been a real > money-loser for > traditional gaming publishers, I understand, but I'm > convinced having > *something* of this material is vital to keeping > your game in play and > thus selling the stuff that *does* make money (core > books). However, > e-publishing may very well remove all the financial > "down-side" to > publishing adventure material and keep most of the > up-side. > > > anyone else have any observations about the gaming > market? feel free > > to email me privately, if it's too OT for the list > anymore... > > Agreed -- it'd be nice to see discussion here in the > open, but if it's > too off-topic, please keep me in the CC loop as > well... There is the alternative of POD (print on demand) which uses the low cost of author type-setting and high speed copier printing, with an actual physical book which can be sold through regular book stores or directly to the customer. Since the Supreme Court ruled (in the Thor decision) that inventory must be taxed at list price value, publishers have cut their backlist and quickly dumped their remainders as soon as the initial sales drop off. Thor related to plumbing supplies, which kept from rust will remain a full value indefinitely. Yet is was applied to publishing where the overwhelming majority of sales occurs in the first year. The downside of POD is that it started as a vanity publishing gimmick and even though there are publishers using this method who are quite willing to bear all the costs, it still hasn't shaken that image. Still, by getting the protection of a printed book, it could be a valuable technique for getting limited demand works (like RPG) published for a reasonable price. Many authors (including me) are waiting to see if this image change is successful. Paul Cardwell __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From grogthing at yahoo.com Sat Aug 7 07:07:23 2004 From: grogthing at yahoo.com (grogthing) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 14:07:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <91380-2200485614313457@M2W077.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <20040806210723.62633.qmail@web41510.mail.yahoo.com> Since Chaosium already has Elric/Stormbringer License, why not publish settings as another sphere in the concept of the million shperes? There would be the modern earth sphere, a future sci-fi sphere, ie.. any setting they wanted to publish would fit nicely into the million spheres concept. Players would be free to custom design their own shperes for their home campaign, and not worry about conflicting with any published material. Greg --- "peter at maranci.net" wrote: > Is a primary world necessary? I was thinking that a > set of original worlds > might be better. That way you'd also avoid the Greg > Trap, i.e. having the > entire system tied to the creative control of a > single individual. > > The different worlds could be linked by an expanded > version of CoC's > Dreamlands, which could also stand in place of the > GodTime for those who > miss that part of Glorantha. I realize that there > might be issues in > connecting SF and really outre universes to the > Dreamlands, though. > > ->Peter Maranci > peter at maranci.net > http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > mail2web - Check your email from the web at > http://mail2web.com/ . > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > ===== "I have sworn, upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." - Thomas Jefferson "It does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." - Thomas Jefferson "Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry "A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious." - Aristotle __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com Sat Aug 7 08:31:25 2004 From: katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com (John Raner) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 15:31:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20040806223125.41034.qmail@web53708.mail.yahoo.com> --- John Pare wrote: > Hi, I have on the list for some time, and I was just > wondering how many > players are from the USA. I have lived in Europe, > and it seemed to be much > more popular there, though I try my hardest to gain > more interest here.. I am in Wyoming. Cheers, John ===== "Keep a government poor and weak and it's your servant; let it get rich and powerful and it's your master." ---- Colonel Andrew Jackson Hickok A state, is called the coldest of all cold monsters. Coldly lieth it also; and this lie creepeth from its mouth: "I, the state, am the people." ---- Friedrich Nietzsche "It is a shame that governments are chiefed by the devil tongues" ---- Chief Ten Bears "There is no such thing as an obsolete weapon or tool, merely obsolete thinking in its employ." ---- Mark D. (CapnCarp at yahoo.com) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From Michael.Christian at corbis.com Sat Aug 7 08:50:45 2004 From: Michael.Christian at corbis.com (Michael.Christian at corbis.com) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 15:50:45 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C7919274109420F2@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> The talk of Glorantha on this list reminds me a great deal sometimes of the way the Linux is discussed on certain computer forums. The similarities being that both are hostile to the new gamer and filled with -philes that get excitable over exceptionally weird small points. I just found the observation amusing and though I would share. -----Original Message----- From: rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com [mailto:rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com]On Behalf Of DevinC at aol.com Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 9:56 AM To: rq-rules at crashbox.com Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP I think Glorantha could be introduced to a new generation of gamers if the entire atmosphere surrounding it were not so hostile to the new gamer. Much of the new material assumes a general knowledge of all things Glorantha, and the culture of Glorantha has become hostile to the idea of casual gaming within the world. Glorantha at the time of Cults of Prax was very friendly to new gamers. You could have a Yelmalian travel around with a Humakti Duck and a Stormbull Bison Rider and no one would look down on you. Now, though, you'd earn the emnity of every serious Glorantha-phile if you mentioned such a thing. Glorantha has sadly become the grounds for scholars rather than gamers. But the core of the world, the magic of it that originally enticed a lot of new gamers in the 70's and 80's is still there. It could theoretically be resurrected, but it would require an immense paragidm shift from its current devotees and would risk alienating its lingering core audience. Also, HQ and HW are extremely difficult game systems for a new GM to master. They really are. They are un-intuitive and place a great burden on the GM and players to fill in the blanks and flesh out the rules. BRP is on the other hand, extremely easy to get into and very easy to master. In other words, I think if: 1. BRP were reinstated as the official system of Glorantha 2. If it were supported with a lot of nice crunchy usable supplements (yes, that means gods, magic items, monsters, and scenarios) [along with the current fleshy bits like a 200 page tome describing the hemlines of Second Age Malkioni noblewomen] It could be embraced by newcomers. Devin _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From Michael.Christian at corbis.com Sat Aug 7 09:01:15 2004 From: Michael.Christian at corbis.com (Michael.Christian at corbis.com) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 16:01:15 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C7919274109420F3@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> It also seems that the group that you are marketing to would likely have an effect on the amount of copying and illegal distribution of your product. If your gaming materials are popular with the 13-20 computer-savvy-but-no-money-newbie D&D player then you can probably expect a lot more piracy. Most adult gamers on the other hand realize that in order for their favorite companies to stay around they need to give them financial support of some sort, usually in the form of buying rather than stealing product. Ultimately the market of young gamers contains the largest numbers, but they are also the most likely to not pay for things (at least electronically). Embracing them seems to be a mixed blessing really. -----Original Message----- From: rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com [mailto:rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com]On Behalf Of Viktor Haag Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 10:35 AM To: RuneQuest rules discussion. Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP On Fri, 06 Aug 2004 12:05:00 -0500, Gerall Kahla wrote: > > the problem with electronic publication is that there's exceptionally > little money in it. i wish people were more honest about re-imbursing > the companies that produce PDFs, but the sad truth is that the nature > of the medium means it's infinitely copyable without loss of fidelity. > once the first copy is sold and downloaded, it can be shared on the > Internet. realistically, companies can only expect one (1) copy to be > legitimately SOLD. My understanding is that the sales data just doesn't bear these commonly held opinions out. I don't run an e-books store, or benefit from the sales of publishing e-books. However, I have heard people debate on both sides of this argument for a number of years now, and I'm inclined to lean towards the argument in favour of e-publishing. If e-books are attractively priced, and well marketed, it wouldn't surprise me at all that they could make money. I'm sure that the "up-side" may not be as high as selling hardcopy books, but then the overhead isn't nearly as large either. Material can be kept indefinitely in print (which is good for publishers, and maybe not so good for authors, but in the RPG market, I don't think the same problems vis a vis on-demand content arise as do in the traditional publishing world); projects that would plainly just fail as printed material can be mounted (buck-a-throw adventures, massive 500-page campaign guides); always-available material can "up-sell" subsequent material much more effectively (i.e. lots of people won't buy Adventure Module C, unless they can reliably get their hands on A and B: e-publishing makes this much more effective). I think it's still a bit too early to tell whether e-publishing is doable for the gaming industry long term. However, I can think of a number of publishers that seem to have incorporated it as part of their core business strategy. It'll be interesting to see where those publishers are in a year, two years, five years, etc. (The ones that leap immediately to mind are Iron Crown, QuickLink Interactive, and BTRC.) Adventure material has traditional been a real money-loser for traditional gaming publishers, I understand, but I'm convinced having *something* of this material is vital to keeping your game in play and thus selling the stuff that *does* make money (core books). However, e-publishing may very well remove all the financial "down-side" to publishing adventure material and keep most of the up-side. > anyone else have any observations about the gaming market? feel free > to email me privately, if it's too OT for the list anymore... Agreed -- it'd be nice to see discussion here in the open, but if it's too off-topic, please keep me in the CC loop as well... -- Viktor _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From pare_jf at hotmail.com Sat Aug 7 09:21:27 2004 From: pare_jf at hotmail.com (John Pare) Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 23:21:27 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question Message-ID: Well, thanks for the replies, I should have added my location, which is Frederica, DE and some time spent in Alexandria VA and Warner Robins GA.... From gkahla at chromebob.com Sat Aug 7 10:34:05 2004 From: gkahla at chromebob.com (Gerall Kahla) Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 19:34:05 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4114237D.7010802@chromebob.com> John Pare wrote: > Hi, I have on the list for some time, and I was just wondering how many > players are from the USA. I have lived in Europe, and it seemed to be > much more popular there, though I try my hardest to gain more interest > here.. I'm in Texas... -- Gerall Kahla -- the Celestial Mechanic [http://chromebob.com/] From steve at perrinworlds.com Sat Aug 7 12:07:45 2004 From: steve at perrinworlds.com (Steve Perrin) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 19:07:45 -0700 Subject: Potter & JKR was Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQStatus. References: <20040806141043.55404.qmail@web41107.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <006601c47c23$66032c00$68417442@wizard> Actually, Greg is not so much a rolegamer as a worldbuilder. Glorantha was supposed to be a world to write novels in, and when that didn't work out, he did the board game. Only then did he discover D&D, largely when a bunch of folks who bought White Bear & Red Moon wrote him to say what a great world it would be to play D&D in. I was one of them. Greg likes to play roles, but his forte is worldbuilding, and he has a natural tendency to want to keep control of his world. Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Leon Kirshtein" To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 7:10 AM Subject: Re: Potter & JKR was Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQStatus. > > I agree. The reason Glorantha appeals to me, I > > think, is because Greg Stafford is a rolegamer > himself. > > That is the problem as well. I found that it supresses > others in developing the setting. > > ===== > Leon Kirshtein > www.godlearner.d2g.com > > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! > http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From steve at perrinworlds.com Sat Aug 7 12:09:17 2004 From: steve at perrinworlds.com (Steve Perrin) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 19:09:17 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP References: <91380-2200485614313457@M2W077.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <007201c47c23$9b13c440$68417442@wizard> Maybe it's time to revive Wonder World... Steve, who had nothing to do with that particular part of Worlds of Wonder. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 7:31 AM Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Is a primary world necessary? I was thinking that a set of original worlds might be better. That way you'd also avoid the Greg Trap, i.e. having the entire system tied to the creative control of a single individual. The different worlds could be linked by an expanded version of CoC's Dreamlands, which could also stand in place of the GodTime for those who miss that part of Glorantha. I realize that there might be issues in connecting SF and really outre universes to the Dreamlands, though. ->Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From leonbk at yahoo.com Sat Aug 7 14:56:27 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 21:56:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Potter & JKR was Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQStatus. In-Reply-To: <006601c47c23$66032c00$68417442@wizard> Message-ID: <20040807045627.35188.qmail@web41105.mail.yahoo.com> --- Steve Perrin wrote: > Actually, Greg is not so much a rolegamer as a > worldbuilder. > > Glorantha was supposed to be a world to write novels > in, and when that > didn't work out, he did the board game. Only then > did he discover D&D, > largely when a bunch of folks who bought White Bear > & Red Moon wrote him to > say what a great world it would be to play D&D in. I > was one of them. > > Greg likes to play roles, but his forte is > worldbuilding, and he has a > natural tendency to want to keep control of his > world. The only problem is that he keeps changing his mind about how things are ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From lancelot at inetnebr.com Sat Aug 7 20:33:00 2004 From: lancelot at inetnebr.com (lance dyas) Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 05:33:00 -0500 Subject: Potter & JKR was Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQStatus. In-Reply-To: <20040807045627.35188.qmail@web41105.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040807045627.35188.qmail@web41105.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4114AFDC.7010508@inetnebr.com> Leon Kirshtein wrote: >--- Steve Perrin wrote: > > >>Actually, Greg is not so much a rolegamer as a >>worldbuilder. >> >>Glorantha was supposed to be a world to write novels >>in, and when that >>didn't work out, he did the board game. Only then >>did he discover D&D, >>largely when a bunch of folks who bought White Bear >>& Red Moon wrote him to >>say what a great world it would be to play D&D in. I >>was one of them. >> >>Greg likes to play roles, but his forte is >>worldbuilding, and he has a >>natural tendency to want to keep control of his >>world. >> >> > >The only problem is that he keeps changing his mind >about how things are > I think its called organic growth and realistic ambiguity combined with revisionistic history ;-) -- Lance Dyas Google Me under : Lost Worlds Roleplaying -- Lance Dyas Lost Worlds Roleplaying - at the Decision Driven Gaming Center http://www.dyasdesigns.com/roleplay/LostWorlds From aescleal at btinternet.com Sat Aug 7 21:28:04 2004 From: aescleal at btinternet.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?ASHLEY=20MUNDAY?=) Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 12:28:04 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C7919274109420F3@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> Message-ID: <20040807112804.9418.qmail@web86209.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Michael C. said: "It also seems that the group that you are marketing to would likely have an effect on the amount of copying and illegal distribution of your product. If your gaming materials are popular with the 13-20 computer-savvy-but-no-money-newbie D&D player then you can probably expect a lot more piracy." Two points on this one: 1. If the price is right, people won't copy. Look at CD sales in the UK - there was a decline in sales, blamed on Napster and the like. However, as soon as the record companies dropped the prices, sales went up. People found it easier and less hassle to buy the CD (or even pay for a download) than search for a ripped copy. 2. "Piracy" is a highly emotive term. As far as I know people aren't sailing the Spanish Main hijacking, killing and stealing. They're making illegal copies of things that they probably wouldn't have bought at any price, which is hardly the same thing. 3. (Okay, I lied, three points) If you catch the gamers young - even with "home taped, it's killing music" material, they're likely to start paying if they like it and when they can afford it. The moral of this lot: Charge what people are willing to pay and people'll buy it. Charge too much and people won't. Cheers, Ash PS: All this is due to Copyright law being a hangover from the days of litho presses being the easiest way of copying material and don't fit well into people's "modern" expectations. PPS: You could also make an argument that copyright (and trademark and woolly things like "IPO") laws have actually knobbled the games industry rather than protected it's interests. They allow the bigguns to get bigger by eating the tiddlers. PPPS: Mismanagement, greed, ego and sheer incompetence don't help either, QED history of RuneQuest and Glorantha. PPPPS: I'll shut up now. PPPPPS: Too late! From aescleal at btinternet.com Sat Aug 7 21:34:29 2004 From: aescleal at btinternet.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?ASHLEY=20MUNDAY?=) Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 12:34:29 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C7919274109420F2@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> Message-ID: <20040807113429.94140.qmail@web86203.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Michael C. also said: "The talk of Glorantha on this list reminds me a great deal sometimes of the way the Linux is discussed on certain computer forums. The similarities being that both are hostile to the new gamer and filled with -philes that get excitable over exceptionally weird small point. I just found the observation amusing and though I would share." Theres one more similarity that comes to mind: They both purport to be "open" to interpretation but the original authors keep a grip like the cliched "scotsman on a fiver" over their creations. [Greg's a bit less patronising about other people's ideas though - he even wants to nick the best ones for Issaries, but that's another story]. Cheers, Ash From aescleal at btinternet.com Sat Aug 7 22:07:38 2004 From: aescleal at btinternet.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?ASHLEY=20MUNDAY?=) Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 13:07:38 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <83.1283864b.2e451208@aol.com> Message-ID: <20040807120738.61369.qmail@web86201.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Devin wrote some things which included: "Much of the new material assumes a general knowledge of all things Glorantha..." Er, I can't really comment on the first point - 'cause I've been using the setting for 25 years, but the second: "...the culture of Glorantha has become hostile to the idea of casual gaming within the world." Sorry to sound quite so abrasive, but, I can't think of a better way to put it, COBBLERS! (I was going to say bollocks, but there might be children present). There might be some ascerbic tossers out there (one geezer from New Zealand that's never actually played an RPG in Glorantha comes to mind) but there are plenty of "casual" games and gamers out there. That's people out to have a bit of fun and who don't really care if they tread on people's toes. This actually includes a vast bunch of the people on the hard-core mailing lists. They're out to have fun with the world. There's even a bunch of advocates (the unfortunately named "Ring" of heroquest narrators)trailing around UK conventions mugging people to play in Glorantha. I could sling some other example your way, but won't bore you. He goes on: "Glorantha at the time of Cults of Prax was very friendly to new gamers. You could have a Yelmalian travel around with a Humakti Duck and a Stormbull Bison Rider and no one would look down on you. Now, though, you'd earn the emnity of every serious Glorantha-phile if you mentioned such a thing." I don't think many people would laugh at that composition. Look at the adventurers used in the HeroQuest examples: Bison Rider, a Humakti, a Puma that wants to be a bloke, some bint on a shell dear, a Lunar and Teshnan that wants to invent surfing. I'm playing in a Prax based game, the main adventuring party is a Yelmalion, a Humakti, a Duck Lanbril devotee and a converted Sartarite Lunar. I'd make a couple of suggestions: 1. Find a group of players that are having fun. If not, start one of your own. Play RQ rather than HQ if that's the system you want to use. 2. Read some of the new HeroQuest stuff - Wintertops Fair FREX is a complete set of related adventures which should be crunchy enough for anyone. Have a look at Simon Phipp's web site for some good pointers as to what's useful for RQ conversion. 3. Don't bother reading the Glorantha digest - but if you do don't pay it much attention unless you really see something that'll help your game. Cheers, Ash From leonbk at yahoo.com Sat Aug 7 22:26:02 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 05:26:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Potter & JKR was Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQStatus. In-Reply-To: <4114AFDC.7010508@inetnebr.com> Message-ID: <20040807122602.74540.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> --- lance dyas wrote: > >>Greg likes to play roles, but his forte is > >>worldbuilding, and he has a > >>natural tendency to want to keep control of his > >>world. > >> > >> > > > >The only problem is that he keeps changing his mind > >about how things are > > > I think its called organic growth and realistic > ambiguity combined > with revisionistic history ;-) No, I would call senility. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From talmeta at talmeta.net Sat Aug 7 22:57:37 2004 From: talmeta at talmeta.net (Tal Meta) Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 08:57:37 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <20040807112804.9418.qmail@web86209.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <20040807112804.9418.qmail@web86209.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4114D1C1.3010802@talmeta.net> ASHLEY MUNDAY wrote: > The moral of this lot: Charge what people are willing > to pay and people'll buy it. Charge too much and > people won't. This is exactly my philosophy on ebay. I will admit it: I am a d20 fan. But I refuse to pay what some companies think their supplements are worth, because I'm poor. In many cases, I do acquire 'pirated' copies first. But the ones I like, I search for on eBay with a very definite idea of how much I am willing to pay, and I keep losing auctions until the folks who want it more than I do run their course, and I get it for the price _I_ think is fair. -- talmeta at talmeta.net - Heretic, Dilettante, & God-Machine AIM - talmeta ICQ - 12594453 Homepage - i am the hate you try to hide From pmj at comhem.se Sun Aug 8 00:28:48 2004 From: pmj at comhem.se (Peter Johansson) Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 16:28:48 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <007201c47c23$9b13c440$68417442@wizard> References: <91380-2200485614313457@M2W077.mail2web.com> <007201c47c23$9b13c440$68417442@wizard> Message-ID: <4114E720.8020401@comhem.se> For nostalgic reasons a reprint of Worlds of Wonder would be great. Future World was the world in which I was introduced to Roleplaying. After that we turned to Drakar & Demoner (eng. Dragons & Demons) which was the Swedish equivalent of BRP and then we began playing Runequest 2. /Peter J Steve Perrin wrote: >Maybe it's time to revive Wonder World... > >Steve, who had nothing to do with that particular part of Worlds of Wonder. > > From alan.richards75 at ntlworld.com Sun Aug 8 02:30:55 2004 From: alan.richards75 at ntlworld.com (alan richards) Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 17:30:55 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Gameworlds In-Reply-To: <20040807113444.7876F222717@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: <27B94AFB-E88F-11D8-A855-000A277B64F4@ntlworld.com> Ooooh now where to start? Middle Earth. Seriously I spent about 1/2 an hour one day a couple of summers ago listing rules tweaks for RQ and ended up with a far superior system to Decipher's effort. That's not because I'm a superb rules author but because BRP 'fits' so well. Legend/ Drenai. Someone already mentioned this. But if anyone has GWs publication of RQIII there are several illustrations lifted straight out of Legend. The advantage here is that David Gemmell's stories are so similar (and I say that as a fan) that one set of rules could cover most of his work. My concern is of course, 'why hasn't it been done before?' Gemmell is such an obvious candidate for a world book that I feel that there must be a strong reason that his work has not been covered. The Culture. Come on you know that you want to play a GSV...... Historical Dark Ages King Arthur. Well obviously 'Historical'. Drawback here is of course that Disney have just made a film so the rights will probably be challenged. Barrayar/Komarr/ Ceteganda/Jackson's Hole from McMaster Bujold's work. Hyperion The 'Night's Dawn' universe Pre-colonisation Southern Africa Pre-colonisation Americas Ancient China Ancient Greece From slposey at concentric.net Sun Aug 8 02:44:45 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 09:44:45 -0700 Subject: Potter & JKR was Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQStatus. In-Reply-To: <20040807122602.74540.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040807122602.74540.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <411506FD.6040208@concentric.net> Leon Kirshtein wrote: > --- lance dyas wrote: > >>>>Greg likes to play roles, but his forte is >>>>worldbuilding, and he has a >>>>natural tendency to want to keep control of his >>>>world. >>>> >>>> >>> >>>The only problem is that he keeps changing his mind >>>about how things are >>> >> >> I think its called organic growth and realistic >>ambiguity combined >>with revisionistic history ;-) > > > No, I would call senility. Ouch! Careful you may be treading on some folks' shibboleths there. ;-) Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com Sun Aug 8 03:49:27 2004 From: katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com (John Raner) Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 10:49:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Gameworlds In-Reply-To: <27B94AFB-E88F-11D8-A855-000A277B64F4@ntlworld.com> Message-ID: <20040807174927.93571.qmail@web53706.mail.yahoo.com> --- alan richards wrote: > Pre-colonisation Southern Africa I'd like to see one set in late 19th Century South Africa. Boer history fascinates me. Cheers, John ===== "Keep a government poor and weak and it's your servant; let it get rich and powerful and it's your master." ---- Colonel Andrew Jackson Hickok A state, is called the coldest of all cold monsters. Coldly lieth it also; and this lie creepeth from its mouth: "I, the state, am the people." ---- Friedrich Nietzsche "It is a shame that governments are chiefed by the devil tongues" ---- Chief Ten Bears "There is no such thing as an obsolete weapon or tool, merely obsolete thinking in its employ." ---- Mark D. (CapnCarp at yahoo.com) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From lancelot at inetnebr.com Sun Aug 8 04:39:13 2004 From: lancelot at inetnebr.com (lance dyas) Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 13:39:13 -0500 Subject: Potter & JKR was Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: 1. Review of Current RQStatus. In-Reply-To: <411506FD.6040208@concentric.net> References: <20040807122602.74540.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> <411506FD.6040208@concentric.net> Message-ID: <411521D1.7050206@inetnebr.com> Stephen Posey wrote: > Leon Kirshtein wrote: > >> --- lance dyas wrote: >> >>>>> Greg likes to play roles, but his forte is >>>>> worldbuilding, and he has a >>>>> natural tendency to want to keep control of his >>>>> world. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> The only problem is that he keeps changing his mind >>>> about how things are >>>> >>> >>> I think its called organic growth and realistic >>> ambiguity combined with revisionistic history ;-) >> >> >> >> No, I would call senility. > > > Ouch! Careful you may be treading on some folks' shibboleths there. ;-) > Not sure what a shibboleth is... but the senility comment is just rude. Lance Dyas Google Me under : Lost Worlds Roleplaying -- Lance Dyas Lost Worlds Roleplaying - at the Decision Driven Gaming Center http://www.dyasdesigns.com/roleplay/LostWorlds From diadochi at bigfoot.com Sun Aug 8 08:58:36 2004 From: diadochi at bigfoot.com (David Ford) Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 23:58:36 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Greg & Glorantha Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.0.20040807235050.01feafa0@pop.ntlworld.com> Steve Perrin wrote: > Actually, Greg is not so much a rolegamer as a > worldbuilder. > > Glorantha was supposed to be a world to write novels > in, and when that > didn't work out, he did the board game. Only then > did he discover D&D, > largely when a bunch of folks who bought White Bear > & Red Moon wrote him to > say what a great world it would be to play D&D in. I > was one of them. > > Greg likes to play roles, but his forte is > worldbuilding, and he has a > natural tendency to want to keep control of his > world. Then someone replied: >The only problem is that he keeps changing his mind >about how things are Then someone else wrote: >I think its called organic growth and realistic ambiguity combined >with revisionistic history ;-) For me: :-) Gregging is a problem because many people like an unambigious world that does not change. Tolkein didn't rewrite Lord of the Rings every five years so why should Stafford? Greg doesn't respect his source material and doesn't realise he hurts his fans by messing with a great fantasy world. My rule would be once you publish something you shouldn't be allowed to change it. The changes in Glorantha combined with the abandonment of RuneQuest have made many people unhappy and disillusioned. Many people still love old Glorantha and fondly remember RQ2. Maybe HeroQuest is a fine game, but I and many others don't wish to play it. David From jurrubin at earthlink.net Sun Aug 8 12:13:03 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (D. Smart) Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 21:13:03 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question References: <4114237D.7010802@chromebob.com> Message-ID: <41158C2F.1030909@earthlink.net> Hey! So am I! I'm in Plano, just north of Dallas. If you don't mind my asking, what area do you call home? David Gerall Kahla wrote: > > John Pare wrote: > >> Hi, I have on the list for some time, and I was just wondering how >> many players are from the USA. I have lived in Europe, and it seemed >> to be much more popular there, though I try my hardest to gain more >> interest here.. > > > I'm in Texas... > From peter at maranci.net Sun Aug 8 14:01:12 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (Peter Maranci) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 00:01:12 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question Message-ID: John Pare wrote: > Hi, I have on the list for some time, and I was just wondering how many > players are from the USA. I have lived in Europe, and it seemed to be > much more popular there, though I try my hardest to gain more interest > here.. I live in Woonsocket, Rhode Island, and work in Boston, MA. You know, I'm mildly tempted to see if we could gather zip codes for all US residents and map them out. I have software that would do that, and the resulting map could be converted into a PDF or JPG. For what possible purpose, I can't imagine. :D ->Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm From Michael.Christian at corbis.com Sun Aug 8 14:09:31 2004 From: Michael.Christian at corbis.com (Michael.Christian at corbis.com) Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 21:09:31 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question Message-ID: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C7919274109420FB@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> I live in Des Moines, Washington (a few miles south of Seattle) Zip is 98198 if you want it Peter. -----Original Message----- From: rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com [mailto:rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com]On Behalf Of Peter Maranci Sent: Saturday, August 07, 2004 9:01 PM To: rq-rules at crashbox.com Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question John Pare wrote: > Hi, I have on the list for some time, and I was just wondering how many > players are from the USA. I have lived in Europe, and it seemed to be > much more popular there, though I try my hardest to gain more interest > here.. I live in Woonsocket, Rhode Island, and work in Boston, MA. You know, I'm mildly tempted to see if we could gather zip codes for all US residents and map them out. I have software that would do that, and the resulting map could be converted into a PDF or JPG. For what possible purpose, I can't imagine. :D ->Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From freyrvanic at earthlink.net Sun Aug 8 14:15:00 2004 From: freyrvanic at earthlink.net (Sven Lugar) Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 21:15:00 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question Message-ID: <410-220048084150203@earthlink.net> Sunland, California 91040 > [Original Message] > From: Peter Maranci > To: > Date: 8/7/2004 9:01:08 PM > Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question > > John Pare wrote: > > > Hi, I have on the list for some time, and I was just wondering how many > > players are from the USA. I have lived in Europe, and it seemed to be > > much more popular there, though I try my hardest to gain more interest > > here.. > > I live in Woonsocket, Rhode Island, and work in Boston, MA. > > You know, I'm mildly tempted to see if we could gather zip codes for > all US residents and map them out. I have software that would do that, > and the resulting map could be converted into a PDF or JPG. For what > possible purpose, I can't imagine. :D > > ->Peter Maranci > peter at maranci.net > http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From gkahla at chromebob.com Sun Aug 8 15:32:54 2004 From: gkahla at chromebob.com (Gerall Kahla) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 00:32:54 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Gameworlds In-Reply-To: <27B94AFB-E88F-11D8-A855-000A277B64F4@ntlworld.com> References: <27B94AFB-E88F-11D8-A855-000A277B64F4@ntlworld.com> Message-ID: <4115BB06.6090208@chromebob.com> alan richards wrote: [snip] > The Culture. Come on you know that you want to play a GSV...... let me say - i've run a *single* Culture scenario for one of my previous groups using BRP. it was a great success. unfortunately, there were only two members besides me at the time... banks' sci-fi is wonderful; finding readership who also roleplay is a little more challenging than finding Star Wars fans, but the rewards are well worth it! [snippin'] > Pre-colonisation Americas there is a yahoo group devoted to 'alternateearthrq' - traffic has been non-existant on it for quite some time, but there was [in the beginning] quite a lot of traffic about this time period from the point of view of the Later Day Saints [a.k.a. modern Mormon's interpretation of history of pre-colonization North America]... the list's been dead for a while, but here's a link: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/alternateearthrq/ > Ancient China Gianni has done a really nice Imperial China write-up in French. as a fan of this time period, i'd recommend it in a shot! http://www.basicrps.com/chine/index.html > Ancient Greece i'd love to see a supplement for this! on the upside, Chaosium has published a monograph about playing CoC in Ancient Rome. stats for The Minotaur [not a species - it's THE Minotaur!], the Furies, centaurs, and write-ups appropriate for decadent Rome. really nice stuff, and easily adaptable to a non-Sanity draining, no-Cthulhu-in-evidence setting... that's called _Cthulhu Invictus_, and should be back on their website soon. i'm thinking of adding a section to my website for book reviews... i've got the new monographs of BRP, as well as _Cthulhu Invictus_. i guess as the time presents itself, these things will manifest. pax -- -- Gerall Kahla -- the Celestial Mechanic [http://chromebob.com/] From gkahla at chromebob.com Sun Aug 8 15:39:03 2004 From: gkahla at chromebob.com (Gerall Kahla) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 00:39:03 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question In-Reply-To: <41158C2F.1030909@earthlink.net> References: <4114237D.7010802@chromebob.com> <41158C2F.1030909@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <4115BC77.1040707@chromebob.com> D. Smart wrote: > Hey! So am I! I'm in Plano, just north of Dallas. > > If you don't mind my asking, what area do you call home? > [snip] well, i'm down here on the Gulf Coast in a city called Beaumont [about 80 miles east of Houston]. according to maps.yahoo.com, i'm only 6hrs and 50 mins away!! if you find yourself in the neighborhood, drop me an email -- pax -- -- Gerall Kahla -- the Celestial Mechanic [http://chromebob.com/] From gkahla at chromebob.com Sun Aug 8 15:46:11 2004 From: gkahla at chromebob.com (Gerall Kahla) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 00:46:11 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4115BE23.8010206@chromebob.com> Peter Maranci wrote: [snips] > You know, I'm mildly tempted to see if we could gather zip codes for > all US residents and map them out. I have software that would do that, > and the resulting map could be converted into a PDF or JPG. For what > possible purpose, I can't imagine. :D there's a player finder on the website for Crocodile Games [http://www.crocodilegames.com/ - a miniatures wargaming company] that you can enter your contact info into... i wonder how difficult it would be to set something like that up for BRP and derivatives? hmmm... more uses present themselves for my newly re-vamped website! oh - Peter - i'm in zip 77706 -- Gerall Kahla -- the Celestial Mechanic [http://chromebob.com/] From ulo at metrocast.net Sun Aug 8 15:01:35 2004 From: ulo at metrocast.net (Christopher E. Fasulo) Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 01:01:35 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question References: <4115BE23.8010206@chromebob.com> Message-ID: <001301c47d04$c8199f00$56a405cf@Beowulf> Strafford, NH 03884 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gerall Kahla" To: ; "RuneQuest rules discussion." Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 1:46 AM Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Question > > > Peter Maranci wrote: > [snips] > > You know, I'm mildly tempted to see if we could gather zip codes for > > all US residents and map them out. I have software that would do that, > > and the resulting map could be converted into a PDF or JPG. For what > > possible purpose, I can't imagine. :D > > there's a player finder on the website for Crocodile Games > [http://www.crocodilegames.com/ - a miniatures wargaming company] that > you can enter your contact info into... > > i wonder how difficult it would be to set something like that up for > BRP and derivatives? > > hmmm... more uses present themselves for my newly re-vamped website! > > oh - Peter - i'm in zip 77706 > > -- > Gerall Kahla -- the Celestial Mechanic > [http://chromebob.com/] > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From ffilz-lists at mindspring.com Sun Aug 8 16:17:53 2004 From: ffilz-lists at mindspring.com (Frank L. Filz) Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 23:17:53 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question In-Reply-To: <410-220048084150203@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <000201c47d0f$70765080$0100a8c0@ffilz> > > You know, I'm mildly tempted to see if we could gather zip codes for > > all US residents and map them out. I have software that > would do that, > > and the resulting map could be converted into a PDF or JPG. For what > > possible purpose, I can't imagine. :D Beaverton Oregon, 97006 Frank From steve at perrinworlds.com Sun Aug 8 16:35:47 2004 From: steve at perrinworlds.com (Steve Perrin) Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 23:35:47 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP References: <91380-2200485614313457@M2W077.mail2web.com> <007201c47c23$9b13c440$68417442@wizard> Message-ID: <004301c47d12$00d244c0$68417442@wizard> Steve Perrin 92708 From kruch7 at cox.net Sun Aug 8 17:13:39 2004 From: kruch7 at cox.net (Joseph Elric Smith Mormon Minion of Arioch) Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 03:13:39 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP References: <91380-2200485614313457@M2W077.mail2web.com><007201c47c23$9b13c440$68417442@wizard> <004301c47d12$00d244c0$68417442@wizard> Message-ID: <00e601c47d17$3b048bd0$1208a8c0@kenneith93j41k> Ken Ruch 92346 Gygax is to Gaming what Kirby was to comics Alas poor Elric I was a thousand times more evil than you Slice N Dice: Game and Pizza Parlour WWBYD What would Brigham Young do ? http://www.geocities.com/J_Elric_Smith/Index.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Perrin" To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 2:35 AM Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP > Steve Perrin > 92708 > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From comogatas at yahoo.com Sun Aug 8 20:45:05 2004 From: comogatas at yahoo.com (Eddy) Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 03:45:05 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] location, location, location Message-ID: <20040808104505.52260.qmail@web40511.mail.yahoo.com> Oxnard, CA, 93033 John Pare wrote: > Hi, I have on the list for some time, and I was just wondering how many > players are from the USA. I have lived in Europe, and it seemed to be > much more popular there, though I try my hardest to gain more interest > here.. I live in Woonsocket, Rhode Island, and work in Boston, MA. You know, I'm mildly tempted to see if we could gather zip codes for all US residents and map them out. I have software that would do that, and the resulting map could be converted into a PDF or JPG. For what possible purpose, I can't imagine. :D --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! From pare_jf at hotmail.com Sun Aug 8 20:40:15 2004 From: pare_jf at hotmail.com (John Pare) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 10:40:15 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP Message-ID: John Pare' Frederica, DE 19946 From talmeta at talmeta.net Sun Aug 8 23:29:10 2004 From: talmeta at talmeta.net (Tal Meta) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 09:29:10 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41162AA6.50802@talmeta.net> Browns Mills, NJ 08015 -- talmeta at talmeta.net - Heretic, Dilettante, & God-Machine AIM - talmeta ICQ - 12594453 Homepage - "What I need is a list of specific unknown problems we will encounter." (Lykes Lines Shipping) From jgould at io.com Mon Aug 9 00:12:00 2004 From: jgould at io.com (Jim Gould) Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 09:12:00 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP In-Reply-To: <004301c47d12$00d244c0$68417442@wizard> References: <91380-2200485614313457@M2W077.mail2web.com> <007201c47c23$9b13c440$68417442@wizard> <004301c47d12$00d244c0$68417442@wizard> Message-ID: Austin, TX 78750 From jurrubin at earthlink.net Mon Aug 9 00:21:26 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (D. Smart) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 09:21:26 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question References: <4114237D.7010802@chromebob.com> <41158C2F.1030909@earthlink.net> <4115BC77.1040707@chromebob.com> Message-ID: <411636E6.5060001@earthlink.net> Oh nerts. I know exactly where Beaumont is but the odds of my getting down there is slim to none. I'll definitely keep your invitation in mind though. I have made it to Houston twice and you're just a hop, skip, and a jump from there. David Gerall Kahla wrote: > > D. Smart wrote: > >> Hey! So am I! I'm in Plano, just north of Dallas. >> >> If you don't mind my asking, what area do you call home? >> > [snip] > > well, i'm down here on the Gulf Coast in a city called Beaumont [about > 80 miles east of Houston]. according to maps.yahoo.com, i'm only 6hrs > and 50 mins away!! > > if you find yourself in the neighborhood, drop me an email -- > > pax -- > From jurrubin at earthlink.net Mon Aug 9 00:23:50 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (D. Smart) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 09:23:50 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP References: <91380-2200485614313457@M2W077.mail2web.com> <007201c47c23$9b13c440$68417442@wizard> <004301c47d12$00d244c0$68417442@wizard> Message-ID: <41163776.30007@earthlink.net> Would you believe after 24 years in Texas, I'm been to Austin only once? And before I forget again... David Smart Plano, TX 75075 Jim Gould wrote: > Austin, TX 78750 > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From rico at ricosweb.com Mon Aug 9 01:26:22 2004 From: rico at ricosweb.com (Rich Allen) Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 09:26:22 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20048892622.253575@lanpc> I'm in Utah. 84015 Rich Allen From freyrvanic at earthlink.net Mon Aug 9 02:57:01 2004 From: freyrvanic at earthlink.net (Sven Lugar) Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 09:57:01 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] location, location, location Message-ID: <410-2200480816571484@earthlink.net> Who lives in Oxnard California? That's the closest RQ player I know of? Maybe a game or twa might be in order. I'm down at the other end of the 118 fwy in Sunland, Ca. 91040 Sven Lugar > [Original Message] > From: Eddy > To: RQ-Rules Digest > Date: 8/8/2004 3:45:14 AM > Subject: [RQ-Rules] location, location, location > > Oxnard, CA, 93033 > > John Pare wrote: > > > Hi, I have on the list for some time, and I was just wondering how many > > players are from the USA. I have lived in Europe, and it seemed to be > > much more popular there, though I try my hardest to gain more interest > > here.. > > I live in Woonsocket, Rhode Island, and work in Boston, MA. > > You know, I'm mildly tempted to see if we could gather zip codes for > all US residents and map them out. I have software that would do that, > and the resulting map could be converted into a PDF or JPG. For what > possible purpose, I can't imagine. :D > > > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From MurfNMurf at aol.com Mon Aug 9 03:01:42 2004 From: MurfNMurf at aol.com (MurfNMurf at aol.com) Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 13:01:42 EDT Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP Message-ID: <8c.11b26cde.2e47b676@aol.com> Ken Murphy 39208 *Fabulous* Pearl, MS From nshapero at ix.netcom.com Mon Aug 9 03:07:50 2004 From: nshapero at ix.netcom.com (Niall Campbell Shapero) Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 10:07:50 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RE: RQ-Rules Digest, Vol 8, Issue 11 Message-ID: <410-2200480817750960@ix.netcom.com> Niall Shapero Los Angeles, 90066 From esoteric at crashbox.com Mon Aug 9 03:38:32 2004 From: esoteric at crashbox.com (Brad Furst) Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 10:38:32 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP In-Reply-To: <004301c47d12$00d244c0$68417442@wizard> References: <91380-2200485614313457@M2W077.mail2web.com> <007201c47c23$9b13c440$68417442@wizard> <004301c47d12$00d244c0$68417442@wizard> Message-ID: -- Brad Furst 97230 From slposey at concentric.net Mon Aug 9 04:35:09 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 11:35:09 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP In-Reply-To: References: <91380-2200485614313457@M2W077.mail2web.com> <007201c47c23$9b13c440$68417442@wizard> <004301c47d12$00d244c0$68417442@wizard> Message-ID: <4116725D.7000507@concentric.net> Stephen Posey Las Vegas, NV 89123 From DevinC at aol.com Mon Aug 9 04:48:30 2004 From: DevinC at aol.com (DevinC at aol.com) Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 14:48:30 EDT Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP Message-ID: <12b.4840372f.2e47cf7e@aol.com> 91301, Southern California Devin From Mechashef at bigpond.com Mon Aug 9 09:31:33 2004 From: Mechashef at bigpond.com (Mechashef) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 09:31:33 +1000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Greg & Glorantha In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.22.0.20040807235050.01feafa0@pop.ntlworld.com> Message-ID: <20040808233230.98D4A2225AD@boomstick.screwheads.net> David Ford wrote: "Tolkein didn't rewrite Lord of the Rings every five years so why should Stafford True, but even Tolkien messed around with his world and really annoyed the fanatics. "Everyone" knows that in Middle Earth, orcs were created from elves because Tolkien wrote that in "Lord of the Rings". In notes he wrote later, he changed it so that they were created from humans. In Tolkien's case I do suspect that senility may have started to set in! _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From lancelot at inetnebr.com Mon Aug 9 12:12:34 2004 From: lancelot at inetnebr.com (lance dyas) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 21:12:34 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP In-Reply-To: <12b.4840372f.2e47cf7e@aol.com> References: <12b.4840372f.2e47cf7e@aol.com> Message-ID: <4116DD92.20102@inetnebr.com> If someone actually wants to map Nebraska, Lincoln, 68510 Google Me under : Lost Worlds Roleplaying -- Lance Dyas Lost Worlds Roleplaying - at the Decision Driven Gaming Center http://www.dyasdesigns.com/roleplay/LostWorlds From ghoyle1 at sbcglobal.net Mon Aug 9 12:56:30 2004 From: ghoyle1 at sbcglobal.net (Guy Hoyle) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 21:56:30 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Greg & Glorantha In-Reply-To: <20040808233230.98D4A2225AD@boomstick.screwheads.net> References: <20040808233230.98D4A2225AD@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: <4116E7DE.4000203@sbcglobal.net> Mechashef wrote: >"Everyone" knows that in Middle Earth, orcs were created from elves because >Tolkien wrote that in "Lord of the Rings". In notes he wrote later, he >changed it so that they were created from humans. > >In Tolkien's case I do suspect that senility may have started to set in! > > Of course, the "Orcs from Elves" information never appeared in LOTR; it was first revealed in "The Silmarillion", which was unfinished at the time of Tolkien's death, and largely edited and completed by Christopher Tolkien. Tolkien's notebooks, which he never intended to have published, show many incomplete drafts and contradictory versions of events. That Silmarillion is contradicted by a draft not intended for publication is really no contradiction at all. Guy Hoyle From slposey at concentric.net Mon Aug 9 13:51:53 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 20:51:53 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Greg & Glorantha In-Reply-To: <4116E7DE.4000203@sbcglobal.net> References: <20040808233230.98D4A2225AD@boomstick.screwheads.net> <4116E7DE.4000203@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <4116F4D9.90504@concentric.net> Guy Hoyle wrote: > Mechashef wrote: > >> "Everyone" knows that in Middle Earth, orcs were created from elves >> because >> Tolkien wrote that in "Lord of the Rings". In notes he wrote later, he >> changed it so that they were created from humans. >> >> In Tolkien's case I do suspect that senility may have started to set in! >> >> > Of course, the "Orcs from Elves" information never appeared in LOTR; it > was first revealed in "The Silmarillion", which was unfinished at the > time of Tolkien's death, and largely edited and completed by Christopher > Tolkien. Tolkien's notebooks, which he never intended to have published, > show many incomplete drafts and contradictory versions of events. That > Silmarillion is contradicted by a draft not intended for publication is > really no contradiction at all. I beg to differ, it is alluded to in The Two Towers, Treebeard makes the following comment to Merry when they're discussing attacking Isengard: "You do not know, perhaps, how strong we are. Maybe you have heard of Trolls? They are mighty strong. But Trolls are only counterfeits, made by the Enemy in the Great Darkness, in mockery of Ents, as Orcs were of Elves." Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From ghoyle1 at sbcglobal.net Mon Aug 9 14:53:14 2004 From: ghoyle1 at sbcglobal.net (Guy Hoyle) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 23:53:14 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Greg & Glorantha In-Reply-To: <4116F4D9.90504@concentric.net> References: <20040808233230.98D4A2225AD@boomstick.screwheads.net> <4116E7DE.4000203@sbcglobal.net> <4116F4D9.90504@concentric.net> Message-ID: <4117033A.2070106@sbcglobal.net> Stephen Posey wrote: > I beg to differ, it is alluded to in The Two Towers, Treebeard makes > the following comment to Merry when they're discussing attacking > Isengard: > > "You do not know, perhaps, how strong we are. Maybe you have heard of > Trolls? They are mighty strong. But Trolls are only counterfeits, made > by the Enemy in the Great Darkness, in mockery of Ents, as Orcs were > of Elves." My mistake, sir! However, that does not change the fact that Tolkien's notebooks were never intended by him for publication, and that what was contained therein is pretty much WIP. Guy From slposey at concentric.net Mon Aug 9 15:20:14 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 22:20:14 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Greg & Glorantha In-Reply-To: <4117033A.2070106@sbcglobal.net> References: <20040808233230.98D4A2225AD@boomstick.screwheads.net> <4116E7DE.4000203@sbcglobal.net> <4116F4D9.90504@concentric.net> <4117033A.2070106@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <4117098E.9020003@concentric.net> Guy Hoyle wrote: > Stephen Posey wrote: > >> I beg to differ, it is alluded to in The Two Towers, Treebeard makes >> the following comment to Merry when they're discussing attacking >> Isengard: >> >> "You do not know, perhaps, how strong we are. Maybe you have heard of >> Trolls? They are mighty strong. But Trolls are only counterfeits, made >> by the Enemy in the Great Darkness, in mockery of Ents, as Orcs were >> of Elves." > > My mistake, sir! However, that does not change the fact that Tolkien's > notebooks were never intended by him for publication, and that what was > contained therein is pretty much WIP. I certainly concede that there's no 100% sure way to know what JRR intended for anything that wasn't published during his lifetime. Nonetheless, some of it makes for fascinating reading and provides great insight into his creative process; sadly other parts make it seem like Christopher T. is just out to make a fast buck on any stray notes his dad may have left lying around. From a gaming perspective, portions of it are very useful to fill "gaps" in our knowledge of Middle Earth as a background setting, but surely must be considered at best secondary sources, not necessarily any more "cannonical" than the Iron Crown modules for MERP (as good as many of them were). Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From freyrvanic at earthlink.net Mon Aug 9 17:53:34 2004 From: freyrvanic at earthlink.net (Sven Lugar) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 00:53:34 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RE: RQ-Rules Digest, Vol 8, Issue 11 Message-ID: <410-220048197533493@earthlink.net> L.A. is turning into an absolute hotbed of RQ! > [Original Message] > From: Niall Campbell Shapero > To: > Date: 8/8/2004 10:12:45 AM > Subject: [RQ-Rules] RE: RQ-Rules Digest, Vol 8, Issue 11 > > Niall Shapero > Los Angeles, 90066 > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Mon Aug 9 18:22:22 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 09:22:22 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: >I think it's still a bit too early to tell whether e-publishing is >doable for the gaming industry long term. However, I can think of a >number of publishers that seem to have incorporated it as part of >their core business strategy. It'll be interesting to see where those >publishers are in a year, two years, five years, etc. (The ones that >leap immediately to mind are Iron Crown, QuickLink Interactive, and >BTRC.) Not to mention small press outfits like Malhavoc, who leave all the print edition work of their books to Sword and Sorcery Studios. It would be fascinating to ask Monte Cook whether he intended Malhavoc to be as big a part of his income as it has apparently become - I rather get the impression that even he has been surprised by how well it has done as a business. Would Chaosium license a small PDF imprint? They have a good relationship with both not-for profit fanzines like The Unbound Book (PDF only) for CoC and print 'zines like the Black Seal, so would they be willing to allow a someone to publish BRP modules in electronic form under a suitable license? As you say, without hard data it's not possible to argue a coherent position about e-publishing and gaming, but I'd have to say, looking at the success of RPGNow, the various PDF publishers (d20 and otherwise), DriveThru and SJG's impending entry into the field, I'd say it is long term a question of _what_ the relationship will be, not whether there will be one - too many gamers have sampled eBooks (via legitimate PDF's or otherwise...) for the industry to NOT deal with them in some fashion. I think Chaosium/BRP desperately need some licensed e-Publishers to support the games myself... >Adventure material has traditional been a real money-loser for >traditional gaming publishers, I understand, but I'm convinced having >*something* of this material is vital to keeping your game in play and >thus selling the stuff that *does* make money (core books). This old saw is one I'd like to see some hard data on. If nothing else, I'd like to see TSR's figures for the late seventies, early eighties, when they were banging out D&D modules at a terrifying rate... and D&D became the dominant RPG and has never been superceded... I wonder whether the analysts are missing an essential linkage: individual modules for game X may have poor margins, but a sufficient volume of them is perhaps the most cost-effective way of convincing the market that X is sufficiently well supported to make it the one to buy? And that it's worth shelling out for it's more substantial (and expensive and thus more profitable supplements) and thus the market never actually gets round to buying the modules in sufficient volumes to make them directly profitable but they have boosted the sales of the GAME... Pure speculation on my part, but as I say, I'd like to see hard figures. RuneQuest survived without a huge volume of support, but the scenario material it did get (Pavis and the Big Rubble, Borderlands, Griffin Mountains) was so rich that it didn't matter... And I say Stormbringer/Elric! was at is most popular '91 - '96 (when it was best supported, although that's a guess). And CoC has remained a perennial favourite and commercially viable game and has had, again, a sustained level of support in terms of adventures (in fact, it wasn't until the early 90's IIRC that it had a supplement that DIDN'T contain at least one scenario...) > However, >e-publishing may very well remove all the financial "down-side" to >publishing adventure material and keep most of the up-side. All the circumstantial, hear say and anecdotal evidence suggest that may well be the case - but one would want hard data before one "bet the farm on it" and sadly I don't have a farm to bet anyway ;-) >> anyone else have any observations about the gaming market? feel free >> to email me privately, if it's too OT for the list anymore... > >Agreed -- it'd be nice to see discussion here in the open, but if it's >too off-topic, please keep me in the CC loop as well... Well, as long as we keep it in terms of strategies for making a success of the new incarnation of RuneQuest, it would seem on topic - ish to me, but if the majority of the list think we're cluttering it up with OT stuff, by all means let's take it to private e-mail... Cheers, Nick Middleton From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Mon Aug 9 18:31:05 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 09:31:05 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Gameworlds Message-ID: >Ooooh now where to start? > > >Middle Earth. Seriously I spent about 1/2 an hour one day a couple of >summers ago listing rules tweaks for RQ and ended up with a far >superior system to Decipher's effort. That's not because I'm a superb >rules author but because BRP 'fits' so well. I'd use BRP's "cousin", Pendragon for a 1st Age Beleriand game, but BRP could work equally well. >Legend/ Drenai. Someone already mentioned this. But if anyone has GWs >publication of RQIII there are several illustrations lifted straight >out of Legend. The advantage here is that David Gemmell's stories are >so similar (and I say that as a fan) that one set of rules could cover >most of his work. My concern is of course, 'why hasn't it been done >before?' Gemmell is such an obvious candidate for a world book that I >feel that there must be a strong reason that his work has not been >covered. > >The Culture. Come on you know that you want to play a GSV...... Only if it's when the run into the Federation from Star Trek - I soooo want to see smug Federation types get the Special Circumstances treatment :-> >Historical Dark Ages King Arthur. Well obviously 'Historical'. Drawback >here is of course that Disney have just made a film so the rights will >probably be challenged. > >Barrayar/Komarr/ Ceteganda/Jackson's Hole from McMaster Bujold's work. > >Hyperion > >The 'Night's Dawn' universe Actually, that could be really cool - I actually like the setting more than the books (especially the middle on of the trilogy), and there is already a guidebook by Hamilton to the setting IIRC. >Pre-colonisation Southern Africa > >Pre-colonisation Americas Ooo, they could be fun. I kept eyeing Nyambe up, with a view to porting it to an Elric! variant but it never got sufficiently cheap in my FLGS... >Ancient China > >Ancient Greece I think these could be quite popular, and don't require license (like the other two historical periods) which is another plus point... Cheers, Nick Middleton From soltakss at yahoo.com Mon Aug 9 18:59:42 2004 From: soltakss at yahoo.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?Simon=20Phipp?=) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 09:59:42 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] RuneQuest and HeroQuest In-Reply-To: <20040806133337.389ED222709@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: <20040809085942.58287.qmail@web51007.mail.yahoo.com> Just as a matter of interest, one of the players in our group bought a pre-release version of the Unfinished Work "Runes and Heroes - HeroQuests and HeroQuesting" as we are about to do the Lightbringers' Quest in our HeroQuest campaign. The front cover has the logos of "RuneQuest" and "HeroQuest" in equal prominence. Probably meaningless, but you never know.... Simon ___________________________________________________________ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Mon Aug 9 18:59:57 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 09:59:57 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Greg & Glorantha Message-ID: >David Ford wrote:> > >"Tolkein didn't rewrite Lord of the Rings every five years >so why should Stafford > >True, but even Tolkien messed around with his world and really annoyed the >fanatics. > >"Everyone" knows that in Middle Earth, orcs were created from elves because >Tolkien wrote that in "Lord of the Rings". In notes he wrote later, he >changed it so that they were created from humans. > >In Tolkien's case I do suspect that senility may have started to set in! Give the man a break! the earliest version of Middle-Earth (the Book of Lost Tales) dates to what, 1916/1917?, when he was convalescing having survived the Somme and he kept adding to and revising that wider mythology his whole life. If it was a deliberate change and not just forgetfulness, he almost certainly would have intended to go back and revise the text of the Lord of the Rings, as he was I gather quite and obsessive about that sort of thing. Completely off topic but I just read "Tolkein and the Great War" (I recommended it to Tolkein buffs), which inspired me to re-read Humphry Carpenter's biography of JRRT as well. Fascinating stuff... Cheers, Nick Middleton From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Mon Aug 9 19:08:45 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 10:08:45 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Greg & Glorantha Message-ID: >Guy Hoyle wrote: > >> Stephen Posey wrote: >> >>> I beg to differ, it is alluded to in The Two Towers, Treebeard makes >>> the following comment to Merry when they're discussing attacking >>> Isengard: >>> >>> "You do not know, perhaps, how strong we are. Maybe you have heard of >>> Trolls? They are mighty strong. But Trolls are only counterfeits, made >>> by the Enemy in the Great Darkness, in mockery of Ents, as Orcs were >>> of Elves." >> >> My mistake, sir! However, that does not change the fact that Tolkien's >> notebooks were never intended by him for publication, and that what was >> contained therein is pretty much WIP. > >I certainly concede that there's no 100% sure way to know what JRR >intended for anything that wasn't published during his lifetime. But it is worth remembering that he _always_ intended that Christopher Tolkein be the executor of his Literary estate, and apparently spent considerable time towards the end of his life discussing with Christopher how to put together the Silmarillion from the existing notes... >Nonetheless, some of it makes for fascinating reading and provides great >insight into his creative process; sadly other parts make it seem like >Christopher T. is just out to make a fast buck on any stray notes his >dad may have left lying around. Actually, to me it looks like a continuing act of uncontrolled grief to rival the monuments of the ancient world: Christopher Tolkein appears to be trying to preserve and venerate every word his father ever wrote as a way of coping with the fact that he's dead. It's sad, but from a readable, and respectful of the authors work POV, I gave up after Unfinished Tales and just wish he'd get counselling or something... >From a gaming perspective, portions of it are very useful to fill >"gaps" in our knowledge of Middle Earth as a background setting, but >surely must be considered at best secondary sources, not necessarily any >more "cannonical" than the Iron Crown modules for MERP (as good as many >of them were). I quite like the _really_ non canon stuff: Far Harad, Greater Harad, Court of Ardor, Shadow in the South etc. Always thought one could do a cracking RQ campaign with that material; not sure it would feel very Tolkein/Middle Earth mind... Cheers, Nick Middleton From nshapero at ix.netcom.com Mon Aug 9 19:44:44 2004 From: nshapero at ix.netcom.com (Niall Campbell Shapero) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 02:44:44 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RE: Location, location, location... Message-ID: <410-220048199444460@ix.netcom.com> > Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 09:57:01 -0700 > From: "Sven Lugar" > Subject: RE: [RQ-Rules] location, location, location > To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." > Message-ID: <410-2200480816571484 at earthlink.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > Who lives in Oxnard California? That's the closest RQ player I know of? > Maybe a game or twa might be in order. > I'm down at the other end of the 118 fwy in Sunland, Ca. 91040 > Sven Lugar West Los Angeles here...(probably about 60 miles away from you...around the 405 and the Marina Freeway -- the 90). -- N. C. Shapero From diadochi at bigfoot.com Mon Aug 9 20:10:35 2004 From: diadochi at bigfoot.com (David Ford) Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 11:10:35 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Changing Worlds, Glorantha, Heroquesting In-Reply-To: <20040809052029.2414022270D@boomstick.screwheads.net> References: <20040809052029.2414022270D@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.0.20040809105052.0202d038@webimap-int.bigfoot.com> > > Stephen Posey wrote: > > > >> I beg to differ, it is alluded to in The Two Towers, Treebeard makes > >> the following comment to Merry when they're discussing attacking > >> Isengard: > >> > >> "You do not know, perhaps, how strong we are. Maybe you have heard of > >> Trolls? They are mighty strong. But Trolls are only counterfeits, made > >> by the Enemy in the Great Darkness, in mockery of Ents, as Orcs were > >> of Elves." > > > > My mistake, sir! However, that does not change the fact that Tolkien's > > notebooks were never intended by him for publication, and that what was > > contained therein is pretty much WIP. > >I certainly concede that there's no 100% sure way to know what JRR >intended for anything that wasn't published during his lifetime. > >Nonetheless, some of it makes for fascinating reading and provides great >insight into his creative process; sadly other parts make it seem like >Christopher T. is just out to make a fast buck on any stray notes his >dad may have left lying around. > > From a gaming perspective, portions of it are very useful to fill >"gaps" in our knowledge of Middle Earth as a background setting, but >surely must be considered at best secondary sources, not necessarily any >more "cannonical" than the Iron Crown modules for MERP (as good as many >of them were). > >Stephen Posey >slposey at concentric.net Well, being a Tolkien novice I don't know of about contradictions. I appreciate that writers do have a change of heart or have new ideas and want to make their creation better. My personal but strongly felt view is that big changes are bad. In Glorantha, Greg has his reasons for making each region's gods more local, for giving each people their own sun god, for making the myths more ambiguous. While much of the ambiguity was mentioned in the RQ2, it was contradicted in RQ3 which had a much more universal feel, saying for instance that Yelm was the sun god for the entire world. HeroQuest has gone the reverse way of RQ3, by making everything local and being far more extreme than RQ2 in making myths the centre of Glorantha gaming. I know this is heresy but it was gaming in Glorantha, and myth-wars that got me interested in RQ. One of my dislikes for HQ is it feels like the game is about forcing your cultural view points on your enemy, a sort of intellectual or philosophical warfare. RQ warfare felt more gritty, down-to-earth, and real. I liked fighting the dragons, trolls and broo. I know you can do this in HeroQuest, but I guess RQ probably does it better. Also, heroquesting is one of the greatest overrated things that came from Glorantha. Like everyone I was excited and fascinated when details about heroquesting leaked out, but now I know what it is, my interest in heroquesting is gone. David From diadochi at bigfoot.com Mon Aug 9 20:13:04 2004 From: diadochi at bigfoot.com (David Ford) Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 11:13:04 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Changing Worlds, Glorantha, Heroquesting argh! Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.0.20040809111140.0202cc78@pop.ntlworld.com> Sorry everyone I meant to say... ... I know this is heresy but it was gaming in Glorantha, and NOT myth-wars that got me interested in RQ. Thanks and sorry, David From leonbk at yahoo.com Mon Aug 9 23:36:31 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 06:36:31 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] RE: Location, location, location... In-Reply-To: <410-220048199444460@ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: <20040809133631.68023.qmail@web41101.mail.yahoo.com> Mahwah NJ 07430 ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From heckman at cfl.rr.com Mon Aug 9 23:36:49 2004 From: heckman at cfl.rr.com (Charles Heckman) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 09:36:49 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: ZIP location References: <20040809052029.2414022270D@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: <009901c47e15$ec6d8530$0202a8c0@OFFICE> Disney World 34761 - Charlie From grogthing at yahoo.com Tue Aug 10 00:43:35 2004 From: grogthing at yahoo.com (grogthing) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 07:43:35 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question In-Reply-To: <20040806223125.41034.qmail@web53708.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040809144335.8170.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> I'm in Nashville Tennessee. Gregory --- John Raner wrote: > --- John Pare wrote: > > Hi, I have on the list for some time, and I was > just > > wondering how many > > players are from the USA. I have lived in Europe, > > and it seemed to be much > > more popular there, though I try my hardest to > gain > > more interest here.. > > I am in Wyoming. > > Cheers, > John > > ===== > "Keep a government poor and weak and it's your > servant; let it get rich and powerful and it's your > master." > ---- Colonel Andrew Jackson Hickok > > A state, is called the coldest of all cold monsters. > Coldly lieth it also; and this lie creepeth from its > mouth: "I, the state, am the people." > ---- Friedrich Nietzsche > > "It is a shame that governments are chiefed by the > devil tongues" > ---- Chief Ten Bears > > "There is no such thing as an obsolete weapon or > tool, merely obsolete thinking in its employ." > ---- Mark D. (CapnCarp at yahoo.com) > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > ===== "I have sworn, upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." - Thomas Jefferson "It does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." - Thomas Jefferson "Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry "A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious." - Aristotle __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From grogthing at yahoo.com Tue Aug 10 00:50:13 2004 From: grogthing at yahoo.com (grogthing) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 07:50:13 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Question In-Reply-To: <000201c47d0f$70765080$0100a8c0@ffilz> Message-ID: <20040809145013.95903.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> Nashville, TN 37217 Gregory --- "Frank L. Filz" wrote: > > > You know, I'm mildly tempted to see if we could > gather zip codes for > > > all US residents and map them out. I have > software that > > would do that, > > > and the resulting map could be converted into a > PDF or JPG. For what > > > possible purpose, I can't imagine. :D > > Beaverton Oregon, 97006 > > Frank > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > ===== "I have sworn, upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." - Thomas Jefferson "It does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." - Thomas Jefferson "Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry "A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious." - Aristotle __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo From katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com Tue Aug 10 00:52:37 2004 From: katkin_kalvin at yahoo.com (John Raner) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 07:52:37 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: ZIP location In-Reply-To: <009901c47e15$ec6d8530$0202a8c0@OFFICE> Message-ID: <20040809145237.4300.qmail@web53702.mail.yahoo.com> Cheyenne, Wyoming 82007 Cheers, John ===== "Keep a government poor and weak and it's your servant; let it get rich and powerful and it's your master." ---- Colonel Andrew Jackson Hickok A state, is called the coldest of all cold monsters. Coldly lieth it also; and this lie creepeth from its mouth: "I, the state, am the people." ---- Friedrich Nietzsche "It is a shame that governments are chiefed by the devil tongues" ---- Chief Ten Bears "There is no such thing as an obsolete weapon or tool, merely obsolete thinking in its employ." ---- Mark D. (CapnCarp at yahoo.com) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From peter at maranci.net Tue Aug 10 00:58:36 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 10:58:36 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Location, Location, Location Message-ID: <57290-22004819145836887@M2W071.mail2web.com> My stupid - I worked up the data this morning, and when I checked back on the list more zips had come in. Guess I'll wait for a few more days and do a more authoritative version. But so my work doesn't go entirely to waste in the meantime, I've slapped up a map and a grid showing how far it is to reach one to four other RQ players on a LiveJournal I just set up for RQ/BRP: http://www.livejournal.com/community/runequest_brp/ Here's hoping that in a few years the map has a lot more dots... ->Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From pare_jf at hotmail.com Tue Aug 10 01:02:24 2004 From: pare_jf at hotmail.com (John Pare) Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 15:02:24 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Nice Job Peter!!! Message-ID: Nice Job Peter....... Real nice job. From tiberius at runequest.za.org Tue Aug 10 01:27:09 2004 From: tiberius at runequest.za.org (tiberius at runequest.za.org) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 17:27:09 +0200 (SAST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Gameworlds Message-ID: <1101.155.239.185.14.1092065229.squirrel@webmail.wack.co.za> John Raner wrote: I'd like to see one set in late 19th Century South Africa. Boer history fascinates me. Very interesting their history is too. I live in SA (born and bred) and I too find the boer hsitroy fascinating. Drop me a line if you have any specific questions and I will try answer them to the best of my knowledge, or those in my group, some of whom are Afrikaanse speaking (baiscally descendants of the boers). Ciao Tony -- Vacca Foeda! From tiberius at runequest.za.org Tue Aug 10 01:33:45 2004 From: tiberius at runequest.za.org (tiberius at runequest.za.org) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 17:33:45 +0200 (SAST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP Message-ID: <1220.155.239.185.14.1092065625.squirrel@webmail.wack.co.za> Rayton 1001, South Africa (if that helps, ha ha Seriously, apologies if some of you ave received an out of office from my work addres (Tony.Den at standardbank.co.za) I am on leave and forgot to unsubscribe my office account. Tony -- Vacca Foeda! From zeitgeistgeist at yahoo.com Tue Aug 10 01:33:40 2004 From: zeitgeistgeist at yahoo.com (zeitgeistgeist at yahoo.com) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 08:33:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP In-Reply-To: <4116DD92.20102@inetnebr.com> Message-ID: <20040809153340.14986.qmail@web53007.mail.yahoo.com> Hey Peter I'm in The Forgotten Borough of NYC - 10304 -Shea Ryan > If someone actually wants to map > Nebraska, Lincoln, 68510 Hey Lance, if you know any Ryans in Lincoln, I'm probably related to them. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From bick10 at comcast.net Tue Aug 10 01:34:23 2004 From: bick10 at comcast.net (bick10 at comcast.net) Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 15:34:23 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Location, Location, Location Message-ID: <080920041534.6763.4117997F00071D0700001A6B2200761438CFCE050C070D@comcast.net> Only a few miles from the Great Lake Michigan. Muskegon, MI 49444 From tiberius at runequest.za.org Tue Aug 10 01:47:54 2004 From: tiberius at runequest.za.org (tiberius at runequest.za.org) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 17:47:54 +0200 (SAST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Gregging, Tolkein etc Message-ID: <1243.155.239.185.14.1092066474.squirrel@webmail.wack.co.za> Much has already been written on these topics. My ZWD6 million {2 cents}: Gregging: I believe a world should change. Chaneg is inevitable, time marches on. Thing is, the world in roleplaying should change with the group. Think of it as a tree, each branch represents how a different set of events (possibly orcastrated by a specific group) would have change the world. So there is the problem, one set of people may want to have the Lunars overrun the whole of generatla,w hile otehrs would liek to see them wiped from the face of glorantha. Personally, if I were in charge of a world, I would go for a kinda yearbook concept detailing soem general events that would not vastly affect anyones campaigns. It coudl be of such a general nature that any events that would contradics a campaign could easily be ignored without making the whole yearbook unusable by a specific group. On Tolkein: Methinks Christopher has always cashed in on JRR's work. One wonders how long before JRR Tolkein - The laundry lists, or JRR Tolkein - The ,edicine prescriptions are published:) Cheers Tony -- Vacca Foeda! From viktor.haag at gmail.com Tue Aug 10 03:08:21 2004 From: viktor.haag at gmail.com (Viktor Haag) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 13:08:21 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Locations by ZIP In-Reply-To: <20040809153340.14986.qmail@web53007.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040809153340.14986.qmail@web53007.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1786319f0408091008dcfd69c@mail.gmail.com> I'm in Southern Ontario, Canada. N2L 5Z5. -- Viktor From viktor.haag at gmail.com Tue Aug 10 03:15:49 2004 From: viktor.haag at gmail.com (Viktor Haag) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 13:15:49 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Actual rules question... Message-ID: <1786319f04080910151ffc4f99@mail.gmail.com> With all the discussion of the new BRP documents, I dragged out my copy of RQ to re-read it, and ran across something that provoked an actual rules question: How do temples, and divine magic users, get taught the spirit magic that's friendly to their cult? Do temples have "friendly shamans" hidden away in a small room off the sept? Or do they have "god-friendly" versions of the spells that are learned in the same way as divine magic, just with no POW expenditure? The RQ3 rules seem remarkably ambiguous on the whole issue. What have people done in their campaigns about this issue? (Yes, I am indeed thinking about using RQ/BRP for a new fantasy campaign, set in a world of my own divising.) -- Viktor From leonbk at yahoo.com Tue Aug 10 03:24:35 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 10:24:35 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Actual rules question... In-Reply-To: <1786319f04080910151ffc4f99@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20040809172435.12067.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> --- Viktor Haag wrote: > How do temples, and divine magic users, get taught > the spirit magic > that's friendly to their cult? Do temples have > "friendly shamans" > hidden away in a small room off the sept? Or do they > have > "god-friendly" versions of the spells that are > learned in the same way > as divine magic, just with no POW expenditure? > > The RQ3 rules seem remarkably ambiguous on the whole > issue. According to the RQ3 rules, Spellteaching is a spell which summons a friendly cult spirit which is then engages in spirit combat with the initiate. If the initiate win then he learns the spell. Cult, which do not have access to Spellteaching, usually accept shaman, who teach other initiates spirit magic. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From aescleal at btinternet.com Tue Aug 10 03:37:40 2004 From: aescleal at btinternet.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?ASHLEY=20MUNDAY?=) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 18:37:40 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Actual rules question... In-Reply-To: <1786319f04080910151ffc4f99@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20040809173740.92538.qmail@web86209.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> A priest that wants to teach (or learn) a spell uses the Spell Teaching divine magic spell to summon a Spell Spirit from wherever his or her God stashes 'em. Cheers, Ash From jurrubin at earthlink.net Tue Aug 10 03:48:12 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 12:48:12 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: ZIP location Message-ID: <18855731.1092073692298.JavaMail.root@scooter.psp.pas.earthlink.net> You LIVE at Disney World?!? Don't you get tired of all the tourists traipsing through your living room? :P David -----Original Message----- From: Charles Heckman Sent: Aug 9, 2004 8:36 AM To: rq-rules at crashbox.com Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: ZIP location Disney World 34761 - Charlie _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From sdavies2720 at yahoo.com Tue Aug 10 03:52:53 2004 From: sdavies2720 at yahoo.com (Steve Davies) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 10:52:53 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: US Location In-Reply-To: <20040809172458.C22B9222723@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: <20040809175253.46659.qmail@web21124.mail.yahoo.com> I'm in Evanston IL 60201 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From jurrubin at earthlink.net Tue Aug 10 04:11:03 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 13:11:03 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Changing Worlds, Glorantha, Heroquesting Message-ID: <19732714.1092075063680.JavaMail.root@scooter.psp.pas.earthlink.net> I'm with youl, David. I enjoyed RQ initially because of the building up of skills rather than for becoming a Runelord. For me, heroquesting was too much like the munchkinism that D&D seemed to profilerate. I much prefer to NOT go heroquesting so Glorantha (at least the way it was portrayed by my GMs at the time) lost its appeal to me as a campaign rather early. David Smart -----Original Message----- From: David Ford Sent: Aug 9, 2004 5:10 AM To: rq-rules at crashbox.com Subject: [RQ-Rules] Changing Worlds, Glorantha, Heroquesting One of my dislikes for HQ is it feels like the game is about forcing your cultural view points on your enemy, a sort of intellectual or philosophical warfare. RQ warfare felt more gritty, down-to-earth, and real. I liked fighting the dragons, trolls and broo. I know you can do this in HeroQuest, but I guess RQ probably does it better. Also, heroquesting is one of the greatest overrated things that came from Glorantha. Like everyone I was excited and fascinated when details about heroquesting leaked out, but now I know what it is, my interest in heroquesting is gone. David From DevinC at aol.com Tue Aug 10 04:13:28 2004 From: DevinC at aol.com (DevinC at aol.com) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 14:13:28 EDT Subject: [RQ-Rules] Gregging, Tolkein etc Message-ID: <8a.11c9560f.2e4918c8@aol.com> In a message dated 8/9/2004 8:37:32 AM Pacific Daylight Time, tiberius at runequest.za.org writes: <> I don't think anyone is decrying change as a chronological fact. The problem is RETROACTIVE change. That is a Greg specialty. Devin From leonbk at yahoo.com Tue Aug 10 04:18:23 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 11:18:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Gregging, Tolkein etc In-Reply-To: <8a.11c9560f.2e4918c8@aol.com> Message-ID: <20040809181823.40101.qmail@web41115.mail.yahoo.com> --- DevinC at aol.com wrote: > I don't think anyone is decrying change as a > chronological fact. The problem > is RETROACTIVE change. That is a Greg specialty. Bullseye. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From leonbk at yahoo.com Tue Aug 10 04:21:43 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 11:21:43 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Changing Worlds, Glorantha, Heroquesting In-Reply-To: <19732714.1092075063680.JavaMail.root@scooter.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20040809182143.40712.qmail@web41115.mail.yahoo.com> --- David Smart wrote: > I'm with youl, David. I enjoyed RQ initially because > of the building up of skills rather than for > becoming a Runelord. > > For me, heroquesting was too much like the > munchkinism that D&D seemed to profilerate. I much > prefer to NOT go heroquesting so Glorantha (at least > the way it was portrayed by my GMs at the time) lost > its appeal to me as a campaign rather early. We always played HeroQuests as trips outside of Glorantha, in that we would go to other worlds and it would be possible to return with interesting items. This way HeroQuesting was never a problem even if we met our gods some times. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From viktor.haag at gmail.com Tue Aug 10 04:53:26 2004 From: viktor.haag at gmail.com (Viktor Haag) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 14:53:26 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Actual rules question... In-Reply-To: <20040809172435.12067.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040809172435.12067.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1786319f040809115374887db5@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 9 Aug 2004 10:24:35 -0700 (PDT), Leon Kirshtein wrote: > --- Viktor Haag wrote: > > The RQ3 rules seem remarkably ambiguous on the whole > > issue. > > According to the RQ3 rules, Spellteaching is a spell > which summons a friendly cult spirit which is then > engages in spirit combat with the initiate. If the > initiate win then he learns the spell. > > Cult, which do not have access to Spellteaching, > usually accept shaman, who teach other initiates > spirit magic. Ah! That makes so much more sense to me now! I had assumed the reference to 'Spellteaching" was a typo missing the space, and was hunting around for a section entitled 'Spell Teaching" or something. Thanks to Leon and Ash for the assistance. You'd think I'd remember a detail like that. Pfeh. -- Viktor From viktor.haag at gmail.com Tue Aug 10 04:54:37 2004 From: viktor.haag at gmail.com (Viktor Haag) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 14:54:37 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Gregging, Tolkein etc In-Reply-To: <8a.11c9560f.2e4918c8@aol.com> References: <8a.11c9560f.2e4918c8@aol.com> Message-ID: <1786319f04080911543b879dd2@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 9 Aug 2004 14:13:28 EDT, devinc at aol.com wrote: > I don't think anyone is decrying change as a chronological fact. The problem > is RETROACTIVE change. That is a Greg specialty. Thus the verb, I suspect. From pare_jf at hotmail.com Tue Aug 10 09:36:17 2004 From: pare_jf at hotmail.com (John Pare) Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 23:36:17 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Copyrights For spells from list Message-ID: Hi again, A while ago, I recieved a list of spells from Talmeta. He used some of these in his Greyquest rules. I would like to use some of them in some deities I am making in my own world, but I do not know the names of any who created them (they are not listed). What I propose is to give credit to the whole list, when I post these to the web... Is this acceptable to all of you? Please let me know... Thanks John From jdmusic at netzero.net Tue Aug 10 10:29:16 2004 From: jdmusic at netzero.net (jdmusic at netzero.net) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 00:29:16 GMT Subject: [RQ-Rules] Location by Zip Message-ID: <20040809.172934.6762.239198@webmail27.nyc.untd.com> I'm in 93036, right down the street from Eddy...! ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - NetZero HiSpeed! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month -visit www.netzero.com to sign up today! From leonbk at yahoo.com Tue Aug 10 11:13:39 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 18:13:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Copyrights For spells from list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20040810011339.7505.qmail@web41105.mail.yahoo.com> --- John Pare wrote: > Hi again, > > A while ago, I recieved a list of spells from > Talmeta. He used some of > these in his Greyquest rules. I would like to use > some of them in some > deities I am making in my own world, but I do not > know the names of any who > created them (they are not listed). > > What I propose is to give credit to the whole list, > when I post these to the > web... > > Is this acceptable to all of you? > > Please let me know... > John, Unless you plan to make money from this, I am sure nobody will care, I know I won't. However, it would be nice to receive credit. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From freyrvanic at earthlink.net Tue Aug 10 11:27:20 2004 From: freyrvanic at earthlink.net (Sven Lugar) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 18:27:20 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Location by Zip Message-ID: <410-2200482101272093@earthlink.net> Hooray, perhaps we should have a mini RQ convention in Los Angeles environs. Eddy is interested in coming out for Sword combat lessons as well so we're building a community. > [Original Message] > From: jdmusic at netzero.net > To: > Date: 8/9/2004 5:31:31 PM > Subject: [RQ-Rules] Location by Zip > > > I'm in 93036, right down the street from Eddy...! > > > ________________________________________________________________ > The best thing to hit the Internet in years - NetZero HiSpeed! > Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! > Only $14.95/ month -visit www.netzero.com to sign up today! > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From talmeta at talmeta.net Tue Aug 10 12:02:58 2004 From: talmeta at talmeta.net (Tal Meta) Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 22:02:58 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Copyrights For spells from list In-Reply-To: <20040810011339.7505.qmail@web41105.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040810011339.7505.qmail@web41105.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <41182CD2.5070202@talmeta.net> Leon Kirshtein wrote: > Unless you plan to make money from this, I am sure > nobody will care, I know I won't. However, it would > be nice to receive credit. Money or not, the primary reason I've never posted the thing to my website is that I have no idea where significant portions of it came from (that, and I'm arguably too lazy to try and back check it...). -- talmeta at talmeta.net - Heretic, Dilettante, & God-Machine AIM - talmeta ICQ - 12594453 Homepage - Troglodytism does not necessarily imply a low cultural level. From pare_jf at hotmail.com Tue Aug 10 12:17:14 2004 From: pare_jf at hotmail.com (John Pare) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 02:17:14 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Copyrights For spells from list Message-ID: I think that is best thing to do, since there are no authors. Just give credit to the whole list. I will NOT post the whole list given me, and thanks Tal, for the list. Just certain spells. Later, I can send the spells that I will be using, and if it is one of yours, I will be glad to give the needed credit. No, not for sale, just for others who enjoy the game... John >From: Tal Meta >Reply-To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." >To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." >Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Copyrights For spells from list >Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 22:02:58 -0400 > >Leon Kirshtein wrote: > >>Unless you plan to make money from this, I am sure >>nobody will care, I know I won't. However, it would >>be nice to receive credit. > >Money or not, the primary reason I've never posted the thing to my website >is that I have no idea where significant portions of it came from (that, >and I'm arguably too lazy to try and back check it...). > >-- >talmeta at talmeta.net - Heretic, Dilettante, & God-Machine >AIM - talmeta >ICQ - 12594453 >Homepage - > >Troglodytism does not necessarily imply a low cultural level. > >_______________________________________________ >RQ-Rules mailing list >RQ-Rules at crashbox.com >http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules >http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From talmeta at talmeta.net Tue Aug 10 12:25:26 2004 From: talmeta at talmeta.net (Tal Meta) Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 22:25:26 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Copyrights For spells from list In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41183216.9070503@talmeta.net> John Pare wrote: > I think that is best thing to do, since there are no authors. Just give > credit to the whole list. But it's not just the list. The file in question has spells from the rulebooks, from websites I've visited, etc.. Some of those sites might not even be up anymore. In a few cases, I've filed the proverbial serial numbers off of other people's work (as I did keep a copy of the printed version of the file for my own and my player's reference while playing...) Credit wise, that file is a mess. :) -- talmeta at talmeta.net - Heretic, Dilettante, & God-Machine AIM - talmeta ICQ - 12594453 Homepage - I have two very rare photographs. One is a picture of Houdini locking his keys in his car. The other is a rare photograph of Norman Rockwell beating up a child. -- Steven Wright From pare_jf at hotmail.com Tue Aug 10 13:05:19 2004 From: pare_jf at hotmail.com (John Pare) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 03:05:19 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Copyrights For spells from list Message-ID: Well, I guess, this is gonna be a problem, as far as credit where credit is due. I could just say from many contributers for the Runequest game, as well as those found in various 3rd edition rules.... Or something to that effect... I really see no problem with it, as long as I do not take credit for them, myself... John From freyrvanic at earthlink.net Tue Aug 10 15:20:57 2004 From: freyrvanic at earthlink.net (Sven Lugar) Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 22:20:57 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Copyrights For spells from list Message-ID: <410-22004821052057156@earthlink.net> I would credit by name where you can as common courtesy, even if it's bulleted to a bibliography. > [Original Message] > From: John Pare > To: > Date: 8/9/2004 8:05:19 PM > Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Copyrights For spells from list > > Well, I guess, this is gonna be a problem, as far as credit where credit is > due. > > I could just say from many contributers for the Runequest game, as well as > those found in various 3rd edition rules.... Or something to that effect... > > I really see no problem with it, as long as I do not take credit for them, > myself... > > John > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From diadochi at bigfoot.com Tue Aug 10 18:50:33 2004 From: diadochi at bigfoot.com (David Ford) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 09:50:33 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] we love RQ but Greg can be a cruel dreamer In-Reply-To: <20040810020329.825AF222722@boomstick.screwheads.net> References: <20040810020329.825AF222722@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.0.20040810093426.02043398@webimap-int.bigfoot.com> >From: David Smart > >I'm with youl, David. I enjoyed RQ initially because of the building up of >skills rather than for becoming a Runelord. > >For me, heroquesting was too much like the munchkinism that D&D seemed to >profilerate. I much prefer to NOT go heroquesting so Glorantha (at least >the way it was portrayed by my GMs at the time) lost its appeal to me as a >campaign rather early. The players in the game I was involved with loved the building up of skills. I know that narrative games are in vogue these days, but they really loved rolling up their ticks, and got especially agitated when it was the POW gain roll. I guess that is pretty munchkinesque though, but it felt good and honest. My feeble attempts to run heroquests for them usually resulted in failure - i.e. the scenario wasn't enjoyed. The players did enjoy being lords or priests, but they enjoyed the journey getting there. From: DevinC at aol.com >I don't think anyone is decrying change as a chronological fact. The problem >is RETROACTIVE change. That is a Greg specialty. >From: Leon Kirshtein >Bullseye. From: Viktor Haag >Thus the verb, I suspect. Yeah, although I am still gutted because the Pharaoh was slain by the Lunars and I thought the Holy Country had great promise. :-) Seriously, it is the retroactive change that really makes me want to scream, rip my eyes out, and flay myself. >From: Leon Kirshtein > >We always played HeroQuests as trips outside of >Glorantha, in that we would go to other worlds and it >would be possible to return with interesting items. >This way HeroQuesting was never a problem even if we >met our gods some times. This sounds interesting, did you use Elric or Stormbringer? How did you justify the 'different worlds' or am I taking it too literally? David From diadochi at bigfoot.com Tue Aug 10 18:52:00 2004 From: diadochi at bigfoot.com (David Ford) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 09:52:00 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] stealing spells Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.0.20040810094829.0203e8f8@pop.ntlworld.com> >From: "John Pare" > >Hi again, > >A while ago, I recieved a list of spells from Talmeta. He used some of >these in his Greyquest rules. I would like to use some of them in some >deities I am making in my own world, but I do not know the names of any who >created them (they are not listed). > >What I propose is to give credit to the whole list, when I post these to the >web... > >Is this acceptable to all of you? > >Please let me know... > >Thanks > >John I like stealing spells (and hero cults) too so I'd like to know what peoples views on this are. David From andrew at crashbox.com Tue Aug 10 21:10:16 2004 From: andrew at crashbox.com (Andrew Mellinger) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 04:10:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Copyrights For spells from list In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I would say that you make sure that yoy post a big disclaimer saying that you don't know the origin of these and you aren't the author. Additionally, if anyone sees one they authored and didn't get credit for, they can ask you to remove it. For the most part, the biggest part is to make sure you don't claim them as your own work. -Andrew On Tue, 10 Aug 2004, John Pare wrote: > Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 03:05:19 +0000 > From: John Pare > Reply-To: RuneQuest rules discussion. > To: rq-rules at crashbox.com > Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Copyrights For spells from list > > Well, I guess, this is gonna be a problem, as far as credit where credit is > due. > > I could just say from many contributers for the Runequest game, as well as > those found in various 3rd edition rules.... Or something to that effect... > > I really see no problem with it, as long as I do not take credit for them, > myself... > > John > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From peter.brink at brinkdata.se Tue Aug 10 22:22:41 2004 From: peter.brink at brinkdata.se (Peter Brink) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 14:22:41 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] stealing spells References: <6.0.0.22.0.20040810094829.0203e8f8@pop.ntlworld.com> Message-ID: <013101c47ed4$bbf9bfd0$9d2aa8c0@skadebyran.se> On Tuesday, August 10, 2004 10:52 AM, David Ford wrote: > > I like stealing spells (and hero cults) too so I'd like to know what > peoples views on this are. IANAL, TINLA, etc. etc. To summarize what is said below: do your best to locate the author and ask the author for permission to use his stuff, if you cannot locate that author - don't use any of that authors stuff. The longer version: This issue is a bit of a grey zone. On one hand if you include verbatim copies of someone else's copyrighted material, such as spells, rules, etc. you really need permission to do so. On the other hand it's not absolutely certain that every rule, spell, etc. is eligible for copyright protection, and what is not copyrighted is free for all to use. The best advice would be to err on the safe side and assume that you are dealing with copyrighted material and try to get permission to use it, if you don't manage to get a permission - then don't use that item. If you "port" rules, spells, monsters, etc. from one rules-set to another it is quite probable that you will re-express the idea that lies behind the rule, spell, etc. that you port. This will IMO in most cases result in a new expression, a new work, and you will be the copyright holder to that work. Note, however, that this issue is *very* uncertain in the U.S., which is one of the reasons why the open source/open content movement has created the GPL and the Creative Commons licenses, among others. So, if you live in the US you would be safer of if you ask for permission to publish a "ported" spell or rule. I would love to see more RQ and BRP material released under an open source or open content license. One of the great points of using an open source or open content license is to make it easier for someone else to use your work. Since you have issued a license allowing them to reuse your work (under certain terms) they don't' have to go thru the hassle of locating you and asking for your permission, that part is already taken cared of. The Creative Commons licenses mentioned above are interesting because Creative Commons have created a set of compatible licenses, based on local law but compatible with licenses from other jurisdictions. Presently there are such licenses from: Brazil, Finland, Germany, Netherlands and the US (and possible some more countries which I can't recall at the moment). I hope that a Swedish version will become available soon too, because that would really make it possible for me to share role-playing game content in a way that is safe to both me and to those who would like to use my works. If you would like to publish under a open source/open content license I would *really* recommend you to consider using one of Creative Commons licenses, their "attribution / non-commercial / share-alike" license is the one who has been translated to several different jurisdictions and thus work very well across borders (even better than the GPL, in that respect). I've used a Creative Commons license in two of my projects. I have a Wiki in which most webpage's are licensed under a CC license, you can see how I've solved that at: http://www.rollspelshornan.se/rollspelswiki/pmwiki.php/LegalStuff/TermsOfUse I've also published a PDF file (http://www.rollspelshornan.se/files/wizardry.pdf) which is licensed under a CC license, look at page 2 for an example of how to write a copyright notice when using a CC license and at the last pages for the license itself. Do remember that since I live in Sweden my copyright notice looks a bit different than a US one would. As for ported spells there are few examples of such at my site too, at: http://www.rollspelshornan.se/rollspelswiki/pmwiki.php/BasicRolePlaying/WizardrySpells From leonbk at yahoo.com Tue Aug 10 23:23:14 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 06:23:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] we love RQ but Greg can be a cruel dreamer In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.22.0.20040810093426.02043398@webimap-int.bigfoot.com> Message-ID: <20040810132314.349.qmail@web41103.mail.yahoo.com> --- David Ford wrote: > This sounds interesting, did you use Elric or > Stormbringer? How did you > justify the 'different worlds' or am I taking it too > literally? No, you are right on. We used Stormbringer, Middle Earth, Historical Earth, Black Company, and a lot of other fictional worlds. Over the years we changed history and/or made sure that others did not. One of our greatest accomplishments was preventing one of the Nine from becoming a nazgul! In several campaigns we brought refugees back to Glorantha (similar to the Roman legion from the Harry Turtledoves books). In one case we even brought an Egyptian god to Glorantha (Seeker). Who came to protect and guide some of his people (the jakeel headed Hutakies). In order the maintain the Compromise he assumed a join form with a Gloranthan god Yorocious, which created an interesting cult which I use in my campaigns, YOROCIOUS-SEEKER (http://www.godlearner.d2g.com/Cults/Glorantha/Cult%20-%20Yorocious%20Seeker.htm). Our main enemies from Glorantha were godlearners, Lunars, and Afedjani(?) Empire, who always seem to find like minded induviduals amongst forces of Chaos in many worlds. If you are interested in any particual world let me know and I will tell you some stories. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From rico at ricosweb.com Tue Aug 10 23:43:29 2004 From: rico at ricosweb.com (Rich Allen) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 07:43:29 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] we love RQ but Greg can be a cruel dreamer In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.22.0.20040810093426.02043398@webimap-int.bigfoot.com> Message-ID: <200481074329.634024@laptop> On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 09:50:33 +0100, David Ford wrote: >?The players in the game I was involved with loved the building up of skills. >?I know that narrative games are in vogue these days, but they really loved >?rolling up their ticks, and got especially agitated when it was the POW gain >?roll. I guess that is pretty munchkinesque though, but it felt good and There's absolutely nothing "munchkinesque" about that!! The term "munchkin" was used to refer to someone's younger sibling, or offspring, who wanted to play the game but (in RQ terms) wanted all skills to be at or near 100%, including Spirit magic, Sorcery, and many weapon skills. They (being young) had no concept of character growth, story line, etc; they just wanted to "win" the game. There's also nothing "powergamer" about enjoying the mechanics of the game either. Powergamers try their best to make their character the most powerful it can be within the rules, and are not about to apply creative interpretations of the rules if it gives them an advantage. Rolling up ticks, POW gains, etc. is a vital part of the RQ experience, in my not so humble opinion. :) >?honest. My feeble attempts to run heroquests for them usually resulted in >?failure - i.e. the scenario wasn't enjoyed. The players did enjoy being >?lords or priests, but they enjoyed the journey getting there. I think that's the most important point here. Enjoying the game is the single most important aspect of *playing* the game. Nothing else matters. Rich Allen From rico at ricosweb.com Tue Aug 10 23:51:50 2004 From: rico at ricosweb.com (Rich Allen) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 07:51:50 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] we love RQ but Greg can be a cruel dreamer In-Reply-To: <200481074329.634024@laptop> Message-ID: <200481075150.345458@laptop> On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 07:43:29 -0600, Rich Allen wrote: >?On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 09:50:33 +0100, David Ford wrote: >>?The players in the game I was involved with loved the building up of skills. >>?I know that narrative games are in vogue these days, but they really loved >>?rolling up their ticks, and got especially agitated when it was the POW gain >>?roll. I guess that is pretty munchkinesque though, but it felt good and > >?There's absolutely nothing "munchkinesque" about that!! ?The term "munchkin" was used to refer to someone's younger sibling, or offspring, who wanted to play the game but (in RQ terms) wanted all skills to be at or near 100%, including Spirit magic, Sorcery, and many weapon skills. They (being young) had no concept of character growth, story line, etc; they just wanted to "win" the game. > >?There's also nothing "powergamer" about enjoying the mechanics of the game either. ?Powergamers try their best to make their character the most powerful it can be within the rules, and are not about to apply creative interpretations of the rules if it gives them an advantage. Oops! ^^^^ above > >?Rolling up ticks, POW gains, etc. is a vital part of the RQ experience, in my not so humble opinion. ?:) > >>?honest. My feeble attempts to run heroquests for them usually resulted in >>?failure - i.e. the scenario wasn't enjoyed. The players did enjoy being >>?lords or priests, but they enjoyed the journey getting there. > >?I think that's the most important point here. ?Enjoying the game is the single most important aspect of *playing* the game. ?Nothing else matters. > >?Rich Allen > > >?_______________________________________________ >?RQ-Rules mailing list >?RQ-Rules at crashbox.com >?http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules >?http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From carpgachair at yahoo.com Wed Aug 11 01:54:55 2004 From: carpgachair at yahoo.com (Paul Cardwell) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 08:54:55 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: ZIP location In-Reply-To: <009901c47e15$ec6d8530$0202a8c0@OFFICE> Message-ID: <20040810155455.41830.qmail@web51310.mail.yahoo.com> Bonham, TX 75418. Incidentally, I can use some more testplayers for the Mythworld revision currently under way. If anyone is within range of Bonham, contact me offline. We have one coming from Dallas (about 75 miles, 110km away), so it is apprently worth the trip. RuneQuesters will be able to adapt particularly quickly to this game. Paul Carewell __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From steve at perrinworlds.com Wed Aug 11 11:04:18 2004 From: steve at perrinworlds.com (Steve Perrin) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 18:04:18 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Heroquests on other worlds References: <20040810020329.825AF222722@boomstick.screwheads.net> <6.0.0.22.0.20040810093426.02043398@webimap-int.bigfoot.com> Message-ID: <003e01c47f3f$3158b1e0$68417442@wizard> When I first moved to Southern California, about 9 years ago, an old friend inveigled me into running a RQ game for her gaming group, which was almost entirely female, as it happens. They had been running off and on for years in a Praxian game. So I essentially took them on a pseudo-Heroquest. I was already using what has become SPQR so there was a slight learning curve, but everyone was an adult and easy to get along with. I took them (using an illuminated Duck - they had never trusted ducks before and now never will) to a glacier in which they were told they were protecting the Queen of the North Wind from trolls. Since they were mostly Orlanthi, this set well with them. Actually, they were helping a bunch of Ogres hold prisoner a Troll princess. Illusions are terrible things. They eventually got wise and ended up rescuing the princess, which cracked the glacier. They got off the world just as the glacier started to melt. My followup SPQR campaign was set on the inland sea created by the melting glacier, 50 years later. Too bad none of the original players could participate. Other worlds for "heroquests" works very well. Steve Perrin ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Ford" To: Sent: Tuesday, August 10, 2004 1:50 AM Subject: [RQ-Rules] we love RQ but Greg can be a cruel dreamer >snip<. > > >From: Leon Kirshtein > > > >We always played HeroQuests as trips outside of > >Glorantha, in that we would go to other worlds and it > >would be possible to return with interesting items. > >This way HeroQuesting was never a problem even if we > >met our gods some times. > > This sounds interesting, did you use Elric or Stormbringer? How did you > justify the 'different worlds' or am I taking it too literally? > > David > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From pare_jf at hotmail.com Wed Aug 11 11:35:55 2004 From: pare_jf at hotmail.com (John Pare) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 01:35:55 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Skills & Spells Message-ID: There are a few times that my players have brought up the fact that certain spells change certain skills and stats. This can be time consuming, though relavent to game play. Has anyone devised a way to simplify this process. John Pare "We all have photographic memories - some of us just ran out of film!" Hobbies: RPG's (Mostly Runequest), Scale Model Building (Military Aircraft 1/48th Scale), Origami, Cats, Tropical Fish. AOL IM jfp2000 MSN Messenger pare_jf at hotmail.com Home Page (Work in Progress) http://www.members.tripod.com/mishakel From peter at maranci.net Wed Aug 11 12:07:55 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (Peter Maranci) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 22:07:55 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? Message-ID: I've been coming to the realization that I have a problem. Now that Chaosium is bringing RQ/BRP back (aka The System Formerly Known As RuneQuest), I'm tempted to write some scenarios again. I had a couple of really good ones in the mental pipeline about seven years ago. The problem is this: they're Gloranthan. Pretty DAMN Gloranthan. Although I'm sure that they'd no longer fit in with modern Glorantha, which Greg has by now no doubt retconned into a world inhabited solely by intelligent talking helium balloons and magical bunnies. :D In any case I have no interest at all in the HeroQuest system, and for some reason I have a residual antipathy against the Gloranthan "scholars" who now, I presume, reign supreme in HeroQuest-land. I have no reason to give them my ideas, and I doubt they'd want them anyway. So...do I try to convert my scenarios to some other world? A generic fantasy one, perhaps? Or toss them altogether? I'm not sure if that will work...it might give me writer's block. I'm guessing that the plurality, if not the majority of RQ games being run in this day and age are still Gloranthan, and that no other setting comprises even 3% of the total. Is my guess correct? What worlds do you run in these days? ->Peter ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net Woonsocket, RI Come to Pete's RuneQuest & Roleplaying!: http://www.maranci.net/rq.htm From bick10 at comcast.net Wed Aug 11 15:10:47 2004 From: bick10 at comcast.net (Jim Bickmeyer) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 22:10:47 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Skills & Spells References: Message-ID: <000e01c47f61$932be820$6401a8c0@attbi.com> > John Pare > There are a few times that my players have brought up the fact that certain > spells change certain skills and stats. This can be time consuming, though > relavent to game play. > > Has anyone devised a way to simplify this process. Some of my players are Wargamers enough that they chart out the affects of each spell. They even worked out defferent combinations of the spell. It makes them happy, what can I say. Jim Bickmeyer From ghoyle1 at sbcglobal.net Wed Aug 11 12:16:31 2004 From: ghoyle1 at sbcglobal.net (Guy Hoyle) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 21:16:31 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4119817F.5030806@sbcglobal.net> If it helps, Peter, I play in Sandy Petersen's game, still set in Glorantha and still RuneQuest. Guy From pare_jf at hotmail.com Wed Aug 11 12:22:35 2004 From: pare_jf at hotmail.com (John Pare) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 02:22:35 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? Message-ID: Hey Pete, When I got into RQ, I was aware of Glorantha from the book itself. I had a small interest in it. But when searching for the world and realizing the supplements that came with it, not to mention the cost, I decided not to go there. I cannot say I regret that. Currently, I run RQ on Krynn - Dragonlance. Someone mentioned this setting a while ago, and I never got a response for a merger of info.. The setting works out great. However, with some free time that has come my way (nice way to say un-employment), I have been working on my own world setting. I have never attempted this, and it is more work than I thought - not good with a family and sort of anti-gaming wife. My players are happy with Krynn, though, so I may just stick to that... If anyone is interested, please feel free to check on my site soon, as the info will be posted there in a few days or weeks. John Pare "We all have photographic memories - some of us just ran out of film!" Hobbies: RPG's (Mostly Runequest), Scale Modle Building (Military Aircraft 1/48th Scale), Origami, Cats, Tropical Fish. AOL IM jfp2000 MSN Messenger pare_jf at hotmail.com Home Page (Work in Progress) http://www.members.tripod.com/mishakel From Michael.Christian at corbis.com Wed Aug 11 12:51:17 2004 From: Michael.Christian at corbis.com (Michael.Christian at corbis.com) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 19:51:17 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? Message-ID: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C791927410942107@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> For what it's worth I did a conversion of your scenario The Lost Child to bronze/iron age fantasy Europe and was fairly pleased with it. Not a whole lot of work either if I recall correctly. Made the strangers into Persians and the shrine belonged to Donnar (Thor). Got rid of the scorpion-men (though I don't recall what I replaced them with). Haven't actually gotten a chance to run it yet, but hopefully sometime I will. -----Original Message----- From: rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com [mailto:rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com]On Behalf Of Peter Maranci Sent: Tuesday, August 10, 2004 7:08 PM To: rq-rules at crashbox.com Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? I've been coming to the realization that I have a problem. Now that Chaosium is bringing RQ/BRP back (aka The System Formerly Known As RuneQuest), I'm tempted to write some scenarios again. I had a couple of really good ones in the mental pipeline about seven years ago. The problem is this: they're Gloranthan. Pretty DAMN Gloranthan. Although I'm sure that they'd no longer fit in with modern Glorantha, which Greg has by now no doubt retconned into a world inhabited solely by intelligent talking helium balloons and magical bunnies. :D In any case I have no interest at all in the HeroQuest system, and for some reason I have a residual antipathy against the Gloranthan "scholars" who now, I presume, reign supreme in HeroQuest-land. I have no reason to give them my ideas, and I doubt they'd want them anyway. So...do I try to convert my scenarios to some other world? A generic fantasy one, perhaps? Or toss them altogether? I'm not sure if that will work...it might give me writer's block. I'm guessing that the plurality, if not the majority of RQ games being run in this day and age are still Gloranthan, and that no other setting comprises even 3% of the total. Is my guess correct? What worlds do you run in these days? ->Peter ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net Woonsocket, RI Come to Pete's RuneQuest & Roleplaying!: http://www.maranci.net/rq.htm _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From mattley at gmail.com Wed Aug 11 13:12:07 2004 From: mattley at gmail.com (Matt Conrad) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 22:12:07 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 22:07:55 -0400, Peter Maranci wrote: > I've been coming to the realization that I have a problem. Now that > Chaosium is bringing RQ/BRP back (aka The System Formerly Known As > RuneQuest), I'm tempted to write some scenarios again. Please do, I like your stuff. > So...do I try to convert my scenarios to some other world? A generic > fantasy one, perhaps? Or toss them altogether? I'm not sure if that > will work...it might give me writer's block. I'm guessing that the > plurality, if not the majority of RQ games being run in this day and > age are still Gloranthan, and that no other setting comprises even 3% > of the total. Is my guess correct? What worlds do you run in these > days? This is an easy one from my point of view. Write them any way that seems fun to you, and leave it up to others to decide what to file and putty so that it fits into their campaign or world or whatever. To answer your question, I'm new to RQ, but I'm running in sort-of Glorantha. The big picture and general background is Glorantha, but I paved over a large chunk of what apparently was supposed to be subtropical Verenela, and put in temperate Troizen instead, and am running the current campaign from there. Matt From steve at perrinworlds.com Wed Aug 11 14:48:23 2004 From: steve at perrinworlds.com (Steve Perrin) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 21:48:23 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? References: Message-ID: <002301c47f5e$80623670$68417442@wizard> No idea how much your scenarios are imbedded in Glorantha. The last three RQish campaigns I ran were set respectively in: A sort of Celtic Britain in which I used a lot of pendragon and Ars Magica material as background. The country was known as The Spans because it consisted of mountain valleys, each of which was known as a Span. The one the players started in was called the Steeleye Span, because of the trout in the streams. - That's my story and I'm sticking to it. One roughly based on the Spain of El Cid with a lot of background heisted from Guy Gavriel Kay's Lions of . It was a pretty successful attempt to have a religious system with just one god, though at least three ways of worshipping Him. The most recent was the one I described in my discourse on the glacier game, a territory that came to be called the Middle Sea. That one would probably fit anything you have just fine, as it was a world with a lot of "Strangers" popping in from other worlds. The adventuring party consisted of a Spelljamming Druid, a Forgotten Realms half-elf thief, a pair of rogues from a burrito-shaped world's RQ campaign, a lizardly swordmaster from Earthdawn, a church ward from that El Cid world described above, a flying monkey from Oz, a Shadowrun dwarf with nanotech and a muckin' huge axe, and a troll family from Glorantha (though the actual PC was a human woman who had been miraculously converted into a troll, mostly). And a couple of others, including a Fantasy Hero giant towards the end. You could almost anything in there... Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Maranci" To: Sent: Tuesday, August 10, 2004 7:07 PM Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? I've been coming to the realization that I have a problem. Now that Chaosium is bringing RQ/BRP back (aka The System Formerly Known As RuneQuest), I'm tempted to write some scenarios again. I had a couple of really good ones in the mental pipeline about seven years ago. The problem is this: they're Gloranthan. Pretty DAMN Gloranthan. Although I'm sure that they'd no longer fit in with modern Glorantha, which Greg has by now no doubt retconned into a world inhabited solely by intelligent talking helium balloons and magical bunnies. :D In any case I have no interest at all in the HeroQuest system, and for some reason I have a residual antipathy against the Gloranthan "scholars" who now, I presume, reign supreme in HeroQuest-land. I have no reason to give them my ideas, and I doubt they'd want them anyway. So...do I try to convert my scenarios to some other world? A generic fantasy one, perhaps? Or toss them altogether? I'm not sure if that will work...it might give me writer's block. I'm guessing that the plurality, if not the majority of RQ games being run in this day and age are still Gloranthan, and that no other setting comprises even 3% of the total. Is my guess correct? What worlds do you run in these days? ->Peter ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net Woonsocket, RI Come to Pete's RuneQuest & Roleplaying!: http://www.maranci.net/rq.htm _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From ffilz-lists at mindspring.com Wed Aug 11 14:54:09 2004 From: ffilz-lists at mindspring.com (Frank L. Filz) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 21:54:09 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <002301c47f5f$3d0d02a0$0100a8c0@ffilz> > From: rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com > [mailto:rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com]On Behalf Of Peter Maranci > So...do I try to convert my scenarios to some other world? A generic > fantasy one, perhaps? Or toss them altogether? I'm not sure if that > will work...it might give me writer's block. I'm guessing that the > plurality, if not the majority of RQ games being run in this day and > age are still Gloranthan, and that no other setting comprises even 3% > of the total. Is my guess correct? What worlds do you run in these > days? I'm pretty much a Gloranthan as far as RuneQuest goes (I've got other game systems I like, so I do those for other settings). Of course as others have mentioned, you should do what is most pleasing to you. The rest of us can use it as is if we use the same setting, or we can convert it. Frank From slposey at concentric.net Wed Aug 11 16:34:49 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 23:34:49 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4119BE09.5070400@concentric.net> Peter Maranci wrote: > I've been coming to the realization that I have a problem. Now that > Chaosium is bringing RQ/BRP back (aka The System Formerly Known As > RuneQuest), I'm tempted to write some scenarios again. > > I had a couple of really good ones in the mental pipeline about seven > years ago. The problem is this: they're Gloranthan. Pretty DAMN > Gloranthan. Although I'm sure that they'd no longer fit in with modern > Glorantha, which Greg has by now no doubt retconned into a world > inhabited solely by intelligent talking helium balloons and magical > bunnies. :D > In any case I have no interest at all in the HeroQuest system, and for > some reason I have a residual antipathy against the Gloranthan > "scholars" who now, I presume, reign supreme in HeroQuest-land. I have > no reason to give them my ideas, and I doubt they'd want them anyway. > > So...do I try to convert my scenarios to some other world? A generic > fantasy one, perhaps? Or toss them altogether? I'm not sure if that > will work...it might give me writer's block. I'm guessing that the > plurality, if not the majority of RQ games being run in this day and > age are still Gloranthan, and that no other setting comprises even 3% > of the total. Is my guess correct? I don't have much interest in straight Glorantha materials myself, I find the world interesting to read about, but have no real interest in RPGing in it. What are the most problematic aspects from your perspective? Maybe we can offer some suggestions on genericizing them away from Glorantha. > What worlds do you run in these > days? I'm in the "thinking about it" stage of an alternate ancient Earth setting, taking tips from Clark Ashton Smith's Hyperboria and Posiedonis, Conan/Hyboria, and readings I've been doing recently on "fringe" archaeology regarding pre-historic cultures. I've also recently been translating materials from the French RPG magazine Casus Belli, for a Fantasy world they created for their BRP variant (BaSIC). The world is called Danae and has some interesting background ideas. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From aescleal at btinternet.com Wed Aug 11 17:55:00 2004 From: aescleal at btinternet.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?ASHLEY=20MUNDAY?=) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 08:55:00 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20040811075500.79121.qmail@web86201.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Keep 'em Gloranthan, but your view of Glorantha. There's still plenty of pre-1994 style players and ideas out there, just look at "The Widow's Tale" or "The Paths of the Damned." Cheers, Ash --- Peter Maranci wrote: > I've been coming to the realization that I have a > problem. Now that > Chaosium is bringing RQ/BRP back (aka The System > Formerly Known As > RuneQuest), I'm tempted to write some scenarios > again. > > I had a couple of really good ones in the mental > pipeline about seven > years ago. The problem is this: they're Gloranthan. > Pretty DAMN > Gloranthan. Although I'm sure that they'd no longer > fit in with modern > Glorantha, which Greg has by now no doubt retconned > into a world > inhabited solely by intelligent talking helium > balloons and magical > bunnies. :D > > In any case I have no interest at all in the > HeroQuest system, and for > some reason I have a residual antipathy against the > Gloranthan > "scholars" who now, I presume, reign supreme in > HeroQuest-land. I have > no reason to give them my ideas, and I doubt they'd > want them anyway. > > So...do I try to convert my scenarios to some other > world? A generic > fantasy one, perhaps? Or toss them altogether? I'm > not sure if that > will work...it might give me writer's block. I'm > guessing that the > plurality, if not the majority of RQ games being run > in this day and > age are still Gloranthan, and that no other setting > comprises even 3% > of the total. Is my guess correct? What worlds do > you run in these > days? > > > ->Peter > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net > Woonsocket, RI > Come to Pete's RuneQuest & Roleplaying!: > http://www.maranci.net/rq.htm > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From Alain.RAMEAU at total.com Wed Aug 11 19:07:09 2004 From: Alain.RAMEAU at total.com (Alain.RAMEAU at total.com) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 11:07:09 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Why alternate Earth ? Message-ID: I never found necessary to create alternate Earth campaign for my RQ games : I want to play in a roman like campaign ? I play in the middle of the Lunar Empire (such as in Glamour for "Rome" politics type, and on the fringe of the Orlanthi "Barbarian belt" for fighting type scenario). Want to play mesopotamian/egyptian type ? The Zola Fel area is great. Middle-age ? Go West of Glorantha. Viking ? Go North-West ... etc Most ancient Earth culture are more or less represented in Glorantha, so it should be easy to find one to fit your mood. OK, may be my vision of the various Gloranthan cultures are not "pure Greg vision" but it is still Gloranthan-like enough, IMO, and that's why my players and I like Glorantha (and RQ, but for me both are really linked) so much ! Alain. http://karamo.nexenservices.com/glowar/rq.htm From soltakss at yahoo.com Wed Aug 11 23:30:52 2004 From: soltakss at yahoo.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?Simon=20Phipp?=) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 14:30:52 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Gameworlds In-Reply-To: <20040808142146.B1D74222709@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: <20040811133052.76546.qmail@web51002.mail.yahoo.com> Gerall Kahla: > alan richards wrote: > [snip] > > The Culture. Come on you know that you want to play a GSV...... > [snippin'] > > Pre-colonisation Americas > > there is a yahoo group devoted to 'alternateearthrq' - traffic has > been non-existant on it for quite some time, but there was [in the > beginning] quite a lot of traffic about this time period from the > point of view of the Later Day Saints [a.k.a. modern Mormon's > interpretation of history of pre-colonization North America]... > > the list's been dead for a while, but here's a link: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/alternateearthrq/ Dead? Just sleeping, I hope. When I have more time, I'll kick it off again with some extra info and an auxilliary website. When I have more time .... > > Ancient Greece > i'd love to see a supplement for this! > > on the upside, Chaosium has published a monograph about playing CoC in > Ancient Rome. stats for The Minotaur [not a species - it's THE > Minotaur!], the Furies, centaurs, and write-ups appropriate for > decadent Rome. really nice stuff, and easily adaptable to a > non-Sanity draining, no-Cthulhu-in-evidence setting... that's called > _Cthulhu Invictus_, and should be back on their website soon. Ooh, that sounds good. See Ya Simon ___________________________________________________________ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From jurrubin at earthlink.net Thu Aug 12 01:51:50 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 10:51:50 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Tracking Stat Changes & Hi-Tech (was Re: Skills & Spells) Message-ID: <4844236.1092239510711.JavaMail.root@ernie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> And my group uses an Excel spreadsheet-based character sheet I found on the web and modified for my campaign. Since I use a laptop during our gaming sessions for map display, sound effects, etc., it's easy for me to load their character sheets and tell them what the immediate effects on stat changes are. By the way, using a laptop with web access also allows me to keep a player who moved to New Orleans in the campaign by using email to send real-time maps and send/receive one-on-one messages. he calls in to a cell phone we use that has a speaker function built in. Which begs the question..have anyone else's GM aids gone "hi-tech"? David -----Original Message----- From: Jim Bickmeyer Sent: Aug 11, 2004 12:10 AM To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Skills & Spells > John Pare > There are a few times that my players have brought up the fact that certain > spells change certain skills and stats. This can be time consuming, though > relavent to game play. > > Has anyone devised a way to simplify this process. Some of my players are Wargamers enough that they chart out the affects of each spell. They even worked out defferent combinations of the spell. It makes them happy, what can I say. Jim Bickmeyer _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From leonbk at yahoo.com Thu Aug 12 01:59:43 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 08:59:43 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Tracking Stat Changes & Hi-Tech (was Re: Skills & Spells) In-Reply-To: <4844236.1092239510711.JavaMail.root@ernie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20040811155943.62847.qmail@web41111.mail.yahoo.com> --- David Smart wrote: > And my group uses an Excel spreadsheet-based > character sheet I found on the web and modified for > my campaign. Considering that I make my living with Excel, I been known to design a few. :) It is not difficult to build in mod, damage bonus and SR calculations into the spreadsheet. I also designed a spirit combat spreadsheet. Just plug in your starting POWs and click a button. The spreadsheet tells you who won, gives you a round by round actions and lets you know if there is a power gain roll due. > By the way, using a laptop with web access also > allows me to keep a player who moved to New Orleans > in the campaign by using email to send real-time > maps and send/receive one-on-one messages. he calls > in to a cell phone we use that has a speaker > function built in. > > Which begs the question..have anyone else's GM aids > gone "hi-tech"? For a while I had a player join us through Yahoo IM and a webcam, but he has moved back home and now plays in person. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From gkahla at chromebob.com Thu Aug 12 03:18:40 2004 From: gkahla at chromebob.com (Gerall Kahla) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 12:18:40 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? In-Reply-To: <20040811075500.79121.qmail@web86201.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <20040811075500.79121.qmail@web86201.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <411A54F0.8070700@chromebob.com> ASHLEY MUNDAY wrote: > Keep 'em Gloranthan, but your view of Glorantha. i'll second this vote, Peter - not only does this allow you to avoid writer's block, but it provides others with scenarios which are 'tune-able'. let's look at the facts; i know of no referee who doesn't modify pre-written material before running it... especially amongst the venerable gamers on this list!! [no offense intended, my happy little tribe!] > There's still plenty of pre-1994 style players and > ideas out there, just look at "The Widow's Tale" or > "The Paths of the Damned." these are fine illustrations of just the sort of writing i'm endorsing. if the Hero[Wars,Quest]-crowd wants to use the material, they get to figure out the stats for their magical bunnies just like normal anyway... [snip-o-logy] >>I'm guessing that the >>plurality, if not the majority of RQ games being run >>in this day and >>age are still Gloranthan, and that no other setting >>comprises even 3% >>of the total. Is my guess correct? What worlds do >>you run in these >>days? well, i ran a nice set of games set in a place called 'Thetia' not long ago... plains-dwelling tribes [ethnically composed of humans, centaurs, and windchildren] of Orlanthi and Yelmalians were beset on one border by a forest of Aldyrami [elves and centaurs]. then the Lunars showed up. quickly, the players forged an alliance between the Aldyrami and the tribes of Thetia to repel the worshippers of this 'red moon'. that went really well, then i got a break from running games as another referee took her turn. i occasionally run independent scenarios on an as-yet-unidentified world in it's Underdark-equivallent using d20-style monsters [mostly mind-flayers] as major antagonists... my games are always done in BRP/RQ2/RQ3. hope this is what you were looking for! pax -- -- Gerall Kahla -- the Celestial Mechanic [http://chromebob.com/] From gkahla at chromebob.com Thu Aug 12 03:27:48 2004 From: gkahla at chromebob.com (Gerall Kahla) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 12:27:48 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Tracking Stat Changes & Hi-Tech (was Re: Skills & Spells) In-Reply-To: <4844236.1092239510711.JavaMail.root@ernie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> References: <4844236.1092239510711.JavaMail.root@ernie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <411A5714.6010500@chromebob.com> David Smart wrote: [snip] > Which begs the question..have anyone else's GM aids gone "hi-tech"? > well, i keep all my NPC stats in an OpenOffice spreadsheet, and advance them after games using it. when i create the characters the players run, i do that with a spreadsheet as well so we can track their progress [and i can know what their Listen and Scan rolls are w/o asking the players!]... my laptop hasn't made it to the table yet, tho i don't doubt it will eventually. [just so you know] i must admit to being a Free Software user / Linux guru. for anyone interested in the spreadsheets of others without having to pay for the software, OpenOffice is great! OpenOffice is free, and can convert from/to the Excel format: [http://www.openoffice.org/] [/just so you know] have fun! -- Gerall Kahla -- the Celestial Mechanic [http://chromebob.com/] From aescleal at btinternet.com Thu Aug 12 02:29:32 2004 From: aescleal at btinternet.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?ASHLEY=20MUNDAY?=) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 17:29:32 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Tracking Stat Changes & Hi-Tech (was Re: Skills & Spells) In-Reply-To: <4844236.1092239510711.JavaMail.root@ernie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20040811162932.13342.qmail@web86201.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> David Smart mentioned high tech game aids. I've banned computers from my games as I find them distracting. If I can't see what's going on from a sheet of paper I suffer from information overload, all flow narrative ceases and the entire thing ascends up it's own rectum. I also spend all day as a slave of a computer so I'm damned if their going to get my hobby as well. Cheers, Ash PS: That doesn't stop me using a computer for between game fiddling about and character recording. It's only in game I refuse to give them home room. From rokk at shaw.ca Thu Aug 12 06:09:38 2004 From: rokk at shaw.ca (James Griffith) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 13:09:38 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Tracking Stat Changes & Hi-Tech (was Re: Skills & Message-ID: <001001c47fdf$218d4f00$b400a8c0@jamesxo7u8e4mw> My one internet data line crashed so I'm not sure if my respose went through so I will type out another one :) Some friends and I got together to play RQ again but the problem was we were now scattered all over North America. We use a web server program called Screen Monkey (www.nbos.com) for miniatures, maps, gameplay chat and dice rolling. It does slow down the game a little when compared to a tabletop game but is still fun! I have a voice chat server set up on my Linux box called Teamspeak2 (www.teamspeak.org) its a nice little program that we decided to use over Ventrillo. I have a character/NPC database that lets me flip through the characters sheets quickly but the co-GM is working on a more interactive real time web based character sheet. Between games we have some forums, an email reflector, MSN, IRC and regular email to communicate plus we can still jump into TS2 if we really need to speak rather than type. It does get a little wierd sometimes since the players who are close come over when we play and I'm off in the corner plugged into my computer and they are plugged into the other ones but it works. James And my group uses an Excel spreadsheet-based character sheet I found on the web and modified for my campaign. Since I use a laptop during our gaming sessions for map display, sound effects, etc., it's easy for me to load their character sheets and tell them what the immediate effects on stat changes are. By the way, using a laptop with web access also allows me to keep a player who moved to New Orleans in the campaign by using email to send real-time maps and send/receive one-on-one messages. he calls in to a cell phone we use that has a speaker function built in. Which begs the question..have anyone else's GM aids gone "hi-tech"? David From comogatas at yahoo.com Thu Aug 12 06:37:26 2004 From: comogatas at yahoo.com (Eddy) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 13:37:26 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Location by Zip Message-ID: <20040811203726.51915.qmail@web40506.mail.yahoo.com> I live in Lemonwood. Yes, Lemonwood, and I'm still alive. I don't have car though and I work from home. What part of Oxnard is 93036? Hooray, perhaps we should have a mini RQ convention in Los Angeles environs. Eddy is interested in coming out for Sword combat lessons as well so we're building a community. > [Original Message] > From: jdmusic at netzero.net > To: > Date: 8/9/2004 5:31:31 PM > Subject: [RQ-Rules] > > > I'm in 93036, right down the street from Eddy...! --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. From jurrubin at earthlink.net Thu Aug 12 07:25:01 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 16:25:01 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Tracking Stat Changes & Hi-Tech (was Re: Skills & Spells) Message-ID: <24719673.1092259501551.JavaMail.root@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> I hear what you're saying, Ashley, but I went the other direction and turned aspects of my hobby into a money-maker (i.e. software development for a living). In fact, the laptop I use is provided by my employer. I just load my campaign files from a CD-RW just before each session and remove it all afterwards. The most use I get from my laptop is the display of the maps (area/buildings/etc.) I've developed using Profantasy's software. That and real-time sending of such maps as .jpgs to the player in New Orleans during our sessions. It occasionally slows down gameplay by a few minutes during each transmission but we all take those opportunities to restock on food and drinks and take care of other gaming necessities. ;-) David -----Original Message----- From: ASHLEY MUNDAY Sent: Aug 11, 2004 11:29 AM To: David Smart , "RuneQuest rules discussion." Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Tracking Stat Changes & Hi-Tech (was Re: Skills & Spells) David Smart mentioned high tech game aids. I've banned computers from my games as I find them distracting. If I can't see what's going on from a sheet of paper I suffer from information overload, all flow narrative ceases and the entire thing ascends up it's own rectum. I also spend all day as a slave of a computer so I'm damned if their going to get my hobby as well. Cheers, Ash PS: That doesn't stop me using a computer for between game fiddling about and character recording. It's only in game I refuse to give them home room. From aescleal at btinternet.com Thu Aug 12 15:56:15 2004 From: aescleal at btinternet.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?ASHLEY=20MUNDAY?=) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 06:56:15 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Tracking Stat Changes & Hi-Tech (was Re: Skills & Spells) In-Reply-To: <24719673.1092259501551.JavaMail.root@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20040812055615.8598.qmail@web86206.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> David said: "I hear what you're saying, Ashley, but I went the other direction and turned aspects of my hobby into a money-maker" So did I, and I've regretted it ever since 'cause I can't just drop it when I want now. Cheers, Ash From phil.hibbs at capgemini.com Thu Aug 12 21:58:16 2004 From: phil.hibbs at capgemini.com (Hibbs, Phil) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 12:58:16 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Gameworlds Message-ID: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E9822E@exast02.capgemini.co.u k> >> Ancient Greece Gerall Kahla: >i'd love to see a supplement for this! I have used the ICE "Mythic Greece" (Rolemaster & Hero system supplement) in RQ, I just made up a bunch of heroic powers that the players could choose from: +10 to any stat Raise any stat to 25 10 points of any divine magic reusable once per day 20 points of spirit magic Heroes get one power, Demigods get two (plus get hassled more by the gods) Phil Hibbs Our name has changed. Please update your address book to the following format: "recipient at capgemini.com". This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. From phil.hibbs at capgemini.com Thu Aug 12 22:56:43 2004 From: phil.hibbs at capgemini.com (Hibbs, Phil) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 13:56:43 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Tracking Stat Changes & Hi-Tech Message-ID: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E9822F@exast02.capgemini.co.u k> David Smart: > Which begs the question..have anyone else's GM aids gone "hi-tech"? I did a spreadsheet for Nikk Effingham's point-based character creation system: http://www.snark.freeserve.co.uk/points.xls I have an OpenOffice version of the spreadsheet nowadays, but at one time I couldn't get it to work properly in OOo. I'll see if I can find it, I haven't used it for a while, it may be on my old laptop. Phil Hibbs Our name has changed. Please update your address book to the following format: "recipient at capgemini.com". This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. From slposey at concentric.net Fri Aug 13 00:56:14 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 07:56:14 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Gameworlds In-Reply-To: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E9822E@exast02.capgemini.co.u k> References: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E9822E@exast02.capgemini.co.u k> Message-ID: <411B850E.6000505@concentric.net> Hibbs, Phil wrote: >>>Ancient Greece > > Gerall Kahla: > >>i'd love to see a supplement for this! > > I have used the ICE "Mythic Greece" (Rolemaster & Hero system supplement) in > RQ, I just made up a bunch of heroic powers that the players could choose > from: > > +10 to any stat > Raise any stat to 25 > 10 points of any divine magic reusable once per day > 20 points of spirit magic > > Heroes get one power, Demigods get two (plus get hassled more by the gods) That sounds terrific, very much in line with the fantasy ancients campaign I'm working on. I'd love to see any writeups you have of all that. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From peter at maranci.net Fri Aug 13 02:38:30 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 12:38:30 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? Message-ID: <410-220048412163830725@M2W069.mail2web.com> Sorry it took me a couple of days to follow up, but life intervened. Rather than quote everyone and respond to each point, let me thank everybody and try to address the main themes: About Glorantha: I have to admit that one of my concerns is the possibility of publication for the new BRP. BRP won't be using the Glorantha setting at all, I presume. So if a scenario depends TOO much on Glorantha, I won't be able to modify it and submit it to Chaosium. Not that that's my sole reason for living, or anything, but it helps a lot when writing to think that there may eventually be a commercial market for it. The scenarios are pretty integrated with classic (i.e. pre-"scholar") Glorantha. For example, one depends on the existence of relatively easy teleportation DI for powerful magicians and on the Convergences. Another features a desperate chase across Genertela, ending at the remains of the City of Wonder and (potentially) a journey into the afterlife. If I need to make them non-Gloranthan I'd probably be forced to create a sort of Glorantha-lite, which would be annoying. Not to mention legally questionable. But there's a deeper issue here: the ways in which the shadow of Glorantha falls over the RQ system. For example, the Spirit/Divine/Sorcery spell systems. These have built-in Gloranthan presumptions which are NOT necessary to the RuneQuest system. Other magic systems work just as well in RQ. If you want to simulate Middle Earth magic, or graft in Spell Law, or damn near anything else, it's really not hard to do. There could potentially be hundreds of magic systems for RQ, depending on what you want to portray in your campaign. Picking just one, or just a few, limits the system as a whole. I don't know. I suppose if I had my choice I'd like to see Chaosium come out with lots of supplemental magic systems as years go by. But that *would* make it difficult to write scenarios for Chaosium - depending on which magic system(s) you use, you'd be losing potential readers. The same problem applies even to adventures published on my site. Complicated. In the end, though, I suppose that if a Gloranthan idea comes to me I'll use it (while trying to keep the Glorantha flavor from getting too strong, if possible), and otherwise I'll probably go with generic fantasy. With an ocassional foray into different settings. CoC's Dreamlands still fascinates the hell out of me. Say, do you think that Chaosium might "update" CoC to use the new RQ/BRP rules? Maybe put ALL of their current games into the same system? That would be great! On a separate note, John Pare mentioned "a family and sort of anti-gaming wife" - I know what you mean. My wife isn't quite anti-gaming, but she doesn't "get" it. She's willing to try a one-shot game with some of my friends sometime soon, but I'm getting nervous - obviously I'll want to run something that she'll really enjoy. Then when my son learns to read I'll have a small gaming group available at all times...which would be paradise! :D ->Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From peter at maranci.net Fri Aug 13 02:41:21 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 12:41:21 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Location by Zip Message-ID: <660-220048412164121573@M2W061.mail2web.com> I'm going on vacation for a few days, so I've put up the latest version of the RQ Zip Grid/Map. It now includes some zips from the Yahoo BRP and RQ Addicts groups, too. If you live in Los Angeles, I envy you... The results are at http://www.livejournal.com/community/runequest_brp/ ->Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From slposey at concentric.net Fri Aug 13 03:12:21 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 10:12:21 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? In-Reply-To: <410-220048412163830725@M2W069.mail2web.com> References: <410-220048412163830725@M2W069.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <411BA4F5.3000701@concentric.net> peter at maranci.net wrote: > Sorry it took me a couple of days to follow up, but life intervened. > > Rather than quote everyone and respond to each point, let me thank > everybody and try to address the main themes: > > About Glorantha: I have to admit that one of my concerns is the possibility > of publication for the new BRP. BRP won't be using the Glorantha setting at > all, I presume. So if a scenario depends TOO much on Glorantha, I won't be > able to modify it and submit it to Chaosium. Not that that's my sole reason > for living, or anything, but it helps a lot when writing to think that > there may eventually be a commercial market for it. Dunno, I thought one of the motivations was to have a system to match and support the Moon Design reprints. That was nominally what the "BRP Player's Guide" and "Magic Book" were all about, no? BTW, I note that Chaosium has restocked most of the monograph titles that had disappeared a couple of weeks back, but not those titles. > But there's a deeper issue here: the ways in which the shadow of Glorantha > falls over the RQ system. For example, the Spirit/Divine/Sorcery spell > systems. These have built-in Gloranthan presumptions which are NOT > necessary to the RuneQuest system. Other magic systems work just as well in > RQ. If you want to simulate Middle Earth magic, or graft in Spell Law, or > damn near anything else, it's really not hard to do. There could > potentially be hundreds of magic systems for RQ, depending on what you want > to portray in your campaign. Picking just one, or just a few, limits the > system as a whole. > > I don't know. I suppose if I had my choice I'd like to see Chaosium come > out with lots of supplemental magic systems as years go by. But that > *would* make it difficult to write scenarios for Chaosium - depending on > which magic system(s) you use, you'd be losing potential readers. The same > problem applies even to adventures published on my site. Complicated. Having various "official" magic systems doesn't seem to have hurt GURPS much. I think a simple core system (something like the one in Magic World perhaps? which actually pretty closely resembles RQ3 sorcery) with the option of expansion would work as a foundation; then other systems could be added as needed for particular settings. > Say, do you think that Chaosium might "update" CoC to use the new RQ/BRP > rules? Maybe put ALL of their current games into the same system? That > would be great! I think some kind of cross-fertilization is certainly possible. I think it would be imprudent to require dedicated CoC players to have to acquire a second set of rules to play, so it should be kept a complete game. You may recall that first edition CoC included a copy of the old BRP rulebook for its core rules and that didn't work so well. > On a separate note, John Pare mentioned "a family and sort of anti-gaming > wife" - I know what you mean. My wife isn't quite anti-gaming, but she > doesn't "get" it. She's willing to try a one-shot game with some of my > friends sometime soon, but I'm getting nervous - obviously I'll want to run > something that she'll really enjoy. Then when my son learns to read I'll > have a small gaming group available at all times...which would be paradise! > :D Hmmm, so just how many of us are in the boat of having a significant other that doesn't "get it" like that? Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From rico at ricosweb.com Fri Aug 13 03:19:32 2004 From: rico at ricosweb.com (Rich Allen) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 11:19:32 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? In-Reply-To: <410-220048412163830725@M2W069.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <2004812111932.288330@laptop> On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 12:38:30 -0400, peter at maranci.net wrote: >?About Glorantha: I have to admit that one of my concerns is the possibility >?of publication for the new BRP. BRP won't be using the Glorantha setting at >?all, I presume. So if a scenario depends TOO much on Glorantha, I won't be >?able to modify it and submit it to Chaosium. Not that that's my sole reason >?for living, or anything, but it helps a lot when writing to think that >?there may eventually be a commercial market for it. I didn't respond to this on the first go around, as I couldn't quite understand what (aside from place names) would make a scenario so tied to Glorantha it couldn't be published as a non-Glorantha scenario. After reading your further comments, I'm still a little confused but I think it's clearer now. In the case of a chase cross country (something I'd argue is bigger than a "scenario"), it should be fairly easy to generalize each stop, rather than requiring a specific town, city, shrine, watering hole, whatever. In the case of cults, it should be fairly easy to say "cult that worships a thunder/storm god, and provides spell X" rather than naming a specific Gloranthan cult. Broo and other chaos creatures are *not* tied to Glorantha, in my opinion; neither is the concept of cults, even specific cults from the rule books. If Chaosium does go in the direction of many spell systems, then you can either write your scenarios generic enough that the magic system in use doesn't matter, or you target one of them and loose some audience. Modules written for a specific D&D world sell very well, as far as I can see, so I don't see a problem with that approach really. To understand where I'm coming from, my game world (definitely non-Gloranthan) had Griffin Mountain in it, as well as parts of the Forgotten Realms, Greyhawk, Black Company, etc. My players and I pushed most of the cult mechanics of RQ to the background, so that aspect was easy to integrate into my world. Hope this helps a little! :) Rich Allen From phil.hibbs at capgemini.com Fri Aug 13 03:30:44 2004 From: phil.hibbs at capgemini.com (Hibbs, Phil) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 18:30:44 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Gameworlds Message-ID: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E98236@exast02.capgemini.co.u k> Me: >I have used the ICE "Mythic Greece" (Rolemaster & Hero system supplement) in >RQ, I just made up a bunch of heroic powers that the players could choose Stephen Posey: >I'd love to see any writeups you have of all that. I think I still have the character generation stuff on a scrap of paper somewhere. The game wasn't at all serious - my brother played a bard called Merimelodes. My Pendragon games all went the same way too (guess which British comedy series they degenrated into). Phil Hibbs Our name has changed. Please update your address book to the following format: "recipient at capgemini.com". This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. From slposey at concentric.net Fri Aug 13 03:45:49 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 10:45:49 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Gameworlds In-Reply-To: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E98236@exast02.capgemini.co.u k> References: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E98236@exast02.capgemini.co.u k> Message-ID: <411BACCD.2000701@concentric.net> Hibbs, Phil wrote: > Me: > >>I have used the ICE "Mythic Greece" (Rolemaster & Hero system supplement) > > in > >>RQ, I just made up a bunch of heroic powers that the players could choose > > > Stephen Posey: > >>I'd love to see any writeups you have of all that. > > I think I still have the character generation stuff on a scrap of paper > somewhere. The game wasn't at all serious - my brother played a bard called > Merimelodes. Don't tell me: he had a brother named Lunitunes? ;-) > My Pendragon games all went the same way too (guess which > British comedy series they degenrated into). Oooh, a Monty Python and the Holy Grail supplement for Pendragon would be awesome! Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From phil.hibbs at capgemini.com Fri Aug 13 03:50:18 2004 From: phil.hibbs at capgemini.com (Hibbs, Phil) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 18:50:18 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Wikipedia Message-ID: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E98238@exast02.capgemini.co.u k> This page could do with a bit of editing, if anyone fancies it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_Role-Playing The line "I believe the core rules were originally written by Steve Perrin, but I suspect that Greg Stafford, Sandy Petersen, Lynn Willis, and undoubtedly many others contributed to their final form." needs rewriting, encyclopedias should not talk in the first person for a start. Being a wiki, anyone can jump in and edit it. I added the line about the monographs. There's no mention of, or entry for, SPQR (apart from in a Roman context). I'm not sure what the policy is for multiple-meaning terms. Phil Hibbs Our name has changed. Please update your address book to the following format: "recipient at capgemini.com". This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. From pare_jf at hotmail.com Fri Aug 13 03:38:47 2004 From: pare_jf at hotmail.com (John Pare) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 17:38:47 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Peter, Gaming, Wives, and Kids.... Message-ID: Hey Peter, I think we can understand how one gets busy, that is for sure... I think, as far as COC and BRP, that pretty much meets that standard already. Sure, there are few areas when it can be conformed. As far as the spells, well that just takes a little re-wording, from what I can see. No matter what the world, or the system (BRP) they are pretty much playable as they are... Wives: No, mine understands (gets it) but she feels and I quote "If I am going to sit on my @ss for 6 hours, I want something to show for it!". Now, if that is the case, she spends hours watching Soap Opera's (My Least Favorite - As the Stomache Turns) and Talk Shows. What does get for that? More things to nag me on? LOL I am 40, and my oldest of two sons is 14. He loves to game, but again, to Sharon, he gets nothing out of it. But does he? 1) Not spending that time doing drugs, getting in trouble with the law, and it is great for his social skills. Not to mention a pers[ective look at history/mythology... I think she is just frustrated with my enthusiasum in something that does not really have anything to do with her.. She is a wonderful partner and an even more wonderful mother, however.. At least I have something to show, according to Sharon, woth model building, origami, and pets. John Pare "We all have photographic memories - some of us just ran out of film!" Hobbies: RPG's (Mostly Runequest), Scale Model Building (Military Aircraft 1/48th Scale), Origami, Cats, Tropical Fish. AOL IM jfp2000 MSN Messenger pare_jf at hotmail.com Home Page (Work in Progress) http://www.members.tripod.com/mishakel From pare_jf at hotmail.com Fri Aug 13 04:10:59 2004 From: pare_jf at hotmail.com (John Pare) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 18:10:59 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Oops Message-ID: I mis-understood what you were saying on the magic systems of runequest being Glorantha related. I reread your post. Now, I see what you were talking about, and this was the first time I ever noticed that.. Some of the spells do it also.. To be honest, I have what is known a ADD as an adult, and it gets a little hard to read and understand/comprehend what people are trying to convey. So, my responses may reflect this... Gee, maybe that is why Sharon Nags me... LOL John Pare "We all have photographic memories - some of us just ran out of film!" Hobbies: RPG's (Mostly Runequest), Scale Model Building (Military Aircraft 1/48th Scale), Origami, Cats, Tropical Fish. AOL IM jfp2000 MSN Messenger pare_jf at hotmail.com Home Page (Work in Progress) http://www.members.tripod.com/mishakel From andrew at crashbox.com Fri Aug 13 05:51:24 2004 From: andrew at crashbox.com (Andrew Mellinger) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 12:51:24 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Location by Zip In-Reply-To: <660-220048412164121573@M2W061.mail2web.com> References: <660-220048412164121573@M2W061.mail2web.com> Message-ID: I pitch in: 15229. (Pitt PA) just moved here. Who were the guys in PDX? Wish I had known before I moved away... -Andrew On Thu, 12 Aug 2004, peter at maranci.net wrote: > Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 12:41:21 -0400 > From: "peter at maranci.net" > To: rq-rules at crashbox.com > Subject: [RQ-Rules] Location by Zip > > I'm going on vacation for a few days, so I've put up the latest version of > the RQ Zip Grid/Map. It now includes some zips from the Yahoo BRP and RQ > Addicts groups, too. > > If you live in Los Angeles, I envy you... > > The results are at http://www.livejournal.com/community/runequest_brp/ > > ->Peter Maranci > peter at maranci.net > http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > mail2web - Check your email from the web at > http://mail2web.com/ . > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From lorgryt.detroll at verizon.net Fri Aug 13 07:20:53 2004 From: lorgryt.detroll at verizon.net (Bo Whitten) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 14:20:53 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Location by Zip In-Reply-To: References: <660-220048412164121573@M2W061.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20040812141858.02104e68@incoming.verizon.net> Well... now that Andrew has... LOL JK I meant to before, just haven't. 98208, Everett WA for myself and my wife. (Oh no! A gaming couple! RUN! LOL) At 12:51 PM 8/12/2004, you wrote: >I pitch in: > >15229. (Pitt PA) just moved here. > >Who were the guys in PDX? Wish I had known before I moved away... > >-Andrew From Michael.Christian at corbis.com Fri Aug 13 07:40:32 2004 From: Michael.Christian at corbis.com (Michael.Christian at corbis.com) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 14:40:32 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Location by Zip Message-ID: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C791927410942118@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> Holy cow, another RQ player in the greater Seattle area. I'm down in the south-end. Des Moines. My wife has never gamed, but has said she'd be willing to give it a shot. Her brother did as she was growing up, so it's not totally foreign to her. Since she likes comic books, kung-fu films, hockey, and video games I don't think I have it too bad. Outside of occasional squabbles over who gets to use certain electronics. -----Original Message----- From: rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com [mailto:rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com]On Behalf Of Bo Whitten Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2004 2:21 PM To: RuneQuest rules discussion. Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Location by Zip Well... now that Andrew has... LOL JK I meant to before, just haven't. 98208, Everett WA for myself and my wife. (Oh no! A gaming couple! RUN! LOL) At 12:51 PM 8/12/2004, you wrote: >I pitch in: > >15229. (Pitt PA) just moved here. > >Who were the guys in PDX? Wish I had known before I moved away... > >-Andrew _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From steve at perrinworlds.com Fri Aug 13 11:47:53 2004 From: steve at perrinworlds.com (Steve Perrin) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 18:47:53 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Wikipedia References: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E98238@exast02.capgemini.co.u k> Message-ID: <005001c480d7$9c5bc380$68417442@wizard> I fixed a few things. Steve, who thinks that one could always put in a writeup for Steve Perrin's Quest Rules. And why is my name rigged like a hyperlink, but there is no Steve Perrin entry? They seemed hostile to my putting in one for myself... Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Hibbs, Phil" To: Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2004 10:50 AM Subject: [RQ-Rules] Wikipedia > > This page could do with a bit of editing, if anyone fancies it: > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_Role-Playing > > The line "I believe the core rules were originally written by Steve Perrin, > but I suspect that Greg Stafford, Sandy Petersen, Lynn Willis, and > undoubtedly many others contributed to their final form." needs rewriting, > encyclopedias should not talk in the first person for a start. > > Being a wiki, anyone can jump in and edit it. I added the line about the > monographs. > > There's no mention of, or entry for, SPQR (apart from in a Roman context). > I'm not sure what the policy is for multiple-meaning terms. > > Phil Hibbs > > > Our name has changed. Please update your address book to the following format: "recipient at capgemini.com". > > This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From blacklocks at telus.net Fri Aug 13 16:33:58 2004 From: blacklocks at telus.net (The Blacklocks) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 22:33:58 -0800 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Ambushes Message-ID: I have a question for everyone out there about ambushes. My question is around detecting an ambush. What I have used is that one member of the ambushing group makes a Hide roll for the group. Then when the ambushee group comes wondering along, the point guy gets to make a Scan roll and tries to beat the Hide roll. If successful, the point guy sees the ambush and is able to raise the alarm. If not, hope you have some decent armour!!! What do other people use for ambushes? Thanks, The Northern DM From Michael.Christian at corbis.com Fri Aug 13 15:46:29 2004 From: Michael.Christian at corbis.com (Michael.Christian at corbis.com) Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 22:46:29 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Ambushes Message-ID: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C79192741094212C@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> >From a realism standpoint (ex-army infantry, so ambushes are something I know from personal experience) it seems that setting an ambush in game terms would depend on the worst skill of the ambushing party and the best skill of the people who could possibly detect the ambush. All it takes is one screw up (snapped twig, cough, etc.) to completely blow an ambush. Your system seems perfectly viable and what I would use with the above caveats. -----Original Message----- From: rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com [mailto:rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com]On Behalf Of The Blacklocks Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2004 11:34 PM To: Runequest List Subject: [RQ-Rules] Ambushes I have a question for everyone out there about ambushes. My question is around detecting an ambush. What I have used is that one member of the ambushing group makes a Hide roll for the group. Then when the ambushee group comes wondering along, the point guy gets to make a Scan roll and tries to beat the Hide roll. If successful, the point guy sees the ambush and is able to raise the alarm. If not, hope you have some decent armour!!! What do other people use for ambushes? Thanks, The Northern DM _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From aescleal at btinternet.com Fri Aug 13 16:25:02 2004 From: aescleal at btinternet.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?ASHLEY=20MUNDAY?=) Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 07:25:02 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Ambushes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20040813062502.3973.qmail@web86204.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> I'd say everyone on the ambushing side would have to hide or otherwise be concealed, i.e. "You lot lie there, I'll cover you in leaves and whatever and you don't move 'til you hear the signal." Cue the conceal roll. Cheers, Ash --- The Blacklocks wrote: > I have a question for everyone out there about > ambushes. My question is > around detecting an ambush. What I have used is > that one member of the > ambushing group makes a Hide roll for the group. > Then when the ambushee > group comes wondering along, the point guy gets to > make a Scan roll and > tries to beat the Hide roll. If successful, the > point guy sees the ambush > and is able to raise the alarm. If not, hope you > have some decent armour!!! > > What do other people use for ambushes? > > Thanks, > > The Northern DM > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From ericla at ultranet.com Fri Aug 13 16:50:39 2004 From: ericla at ultranet.com (Eric Leventhal Arthen) Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 02:50:39 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Location, Location, Location Zip (MA) In-Reply-To: <57290-22004819145836887@M2W071.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.0.20040813024658.00af4db8@pop.rcn.com> I live in western Mass. near Northampton, 01098, and work part of the week (and game) in eastern Mass., near Boston, 02451. I game in a non-Gloranthan, fantasy pair of worlds that I and another GM developed. ------ Eric Leventhal Arthen ericla at ultranet.com From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Fri Aug 13 18:55:06 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 09:55:06 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] The End of Glorantha - Now What? Message-ID: Peter Maranci wrote: >...But there's a deeper issue here: the ways in which the shadow of Glorantha >falls over the RQ system. For example, the Spirit/Divine/Sorcery spell >systems. These have built-in Gloranthan presumptions which are NOT >necessary to the RuneQuest system. But do they limit RuneQuest (or the-game-formerly-known-as-runequest or whatever we're supposed to call it!) to Glorantha? Does Griffin Island (leaving aside ones memories of Griffin Mountain) actually fail, or at least "feel too Gloranthan" to work because it technically has the same magic system as Glorantha? I think some of the points you raise ARE a problem, but the RQ magic systems isn't a significant barrier particularly. I sincerely hope that something like the three RQ magic systems will be in the Advanced BRP book: simple folk magic, as in the charm for luck a peasant carves on his favourite axe or a soldier is granted by the temple of war for his sword before he goes on campaign are well represented by RQ Spirit Magic, just as Divine and Sorcery work well to represent magic power from devotion to a deity and to impersonal occult understanding... As described in RQIII for Mythic Europe I think they were sufficiently generic to be left as the "baseline" magic systems for Advanced BRP. > Other magic systems work just as well in >RQ. If you want to simulate Middle Earth magic, or graft in Spell Law, or >damn near anything else, it's really not hard to do. There could >potentially be hundreds of magic systems for RQ, depending on what you want >to portray in your campaign. Picking just one, or just a few, limits the >system as a whole. Indeed, which is why I hope Chaosium stick with the baseline magic systems from RQIII. If people want significantly variant systems, then that system should be as much a feature of a supplement as the scenarios that go with it. For other scenarios, it should be possible to simply indicate which bits of ABRP are used and which are not ("This book does NOT use Sorcery in any form." "This book uses the Strike Rank system of Combat Sequencing"). Which of course indicates that I'm assuming, for example, that the combat section will outline both using Strike Ranks and using DEX rank as alternative methods of ordering combat... >I don't know. I suppose if I had my choice I'd like to see Chaosium come >out with lots of supplemental magic systems as years go by. But that >*would* make it difficult to write scenarios for Chaosium - depending on >which magic system(s) you use, you'd be losing potential readers. The same >problem applies even to adventures published on my site. Complicated. I would rather Chaosium came out with lots of good supplements: places, situations and people that fire my imagination and that myself and my group will enjoy roleplaying with (whether they are published as scenarios, setting sourcebooks, or ostensibly as the context for rules variants). If Chaosium publish a baseline system, then the smart thing is to write to that baseline, as everyone who has house ruled there own games away from that baseline will be able to apply the same transformations to other published material. If one writes something that relies too much on supplements, one automatically shrinks the potential market/interest to those who know those supplements or are prepared to attempt a conversion without it... >In the end, though, I suppose that if a Gloranthan idea comes to me I'll >use it (while trying to keep the Glorantha flavour from getting too strong, >if possible), and otherwise I'll probably go with generic fantasy. With an >ocassional foray into different settings. CoC's Dreamlands still fascinates >the hell out of me. I think that Chaosium should create a small group of settings for ABRP actually - but not licensed ones and not ones that they do in any detail. Things like Cidri (from TFT:ITL), or that fulfils the same function as Greyhawk in the core D&D 3/3.5 books, Dor-Erthenos in Monte Cooks Arcana Uearthed, or the Imperium in very early Traveller (before most of the history was alluded to). These are NOT detailed campaign worlds (at least as they are used and portrayed in these core rulebooks: Greyhawk, Dor-Erthenos and the Third Imperium are all developed in setting specific publications, but they are optional) but simply "default" settings: this is what the world looks like if it works according to these rules. ABRP should definitely have something like that for each broad genre (Mythic Europe is fine for fantasy, a Generic SF setting should be easy (perhaps ported from Future World), and near contemporary setting as well, say 30's Pulps based) and I think Chaosium should resist all temptations to start filling them out themselves so they can remain defaults. Individual supplements could include suggestions about where to place them in the appropriate default but the supplements wouldn't have to be used there... >Say, do you think that Chaosium might "update" CoC to use the new RQ/BRP >rules? Maybe put ALL of their current games into the same system? That >would be great! Instinctively, I think it would be awful, if by the same rules you me the same detailed implementation of the ABRP tool box. I think nothing would kill the atmosphere quicker in CoC than having to run a physical attack with all the paraphernalia of Strike Ranks, hit locations etc and I suspect that Stormbringer would become comically lethal with hit locations in particular... Chaosium's games are already on the same core rule system, and I hope some of what is learnt putting ABRP together is (for example) fed in to CoC 7th edition, as CoC is in desperate need of a thorough rules over haul (it hasn't been properly edited since 4th edition as far as I can tell and is woefully unclear, impenetrable and confusing in places). But I also hope Chaosium leaves CoC with a simple, clean implementation of BRP, keeps Stormbringer epic and OTT and allows ABRP to be as detailed or cinematic as the players want it to be. Advanced Basic Role Playing shouldn't be single rule system: it should be a tool box. I don't want a d100 Players Handbook, but a d100 "toolbox" (think Hero system core book or GURPS 3rd edition basic set). I don't want all my game worlds to work exactly the same way. I want them to work as is appropriate to the style and genre that suits them best, and I think BRP is particularly well suited to adapting across a wide variety of these (I always felt it scaled better than GURPS, and certainly than d20 has yet done so). It's already easy enough to port between BRP, RQI/II/III, Stormbringer I/-/IV, Elirc!/Stormbringer V/Corum, Hawkmoon I, ElfQuest, CoC I/-/VI, Ringworld, Worlds of Wonder, Superworld. Even Other Suns, Nephilim and Pendragon aren't impossible to adapt to other BRP games. What the Core rulebook needs to do is to regularise and clarify the rules options in BRP and it's variants so it's easy to pick the subsystems one feels appropriate and play in that style of setting... Hmm, rather than rambling further: I want the "new" BRP to be more GURPS like in its format and structure! But with a more RQII approach to supplelemnts... > >On a separate note, John Pare mentioned "a family and sort of anti-gaming >wife" - I know what you mean. My wife isn't quite anti-gaming, but she >doesn't "get" it. She's willing to try a one-shot game with some of my >friends sometime soon, but I'm getting nervous - obviously I'll want to run >something that she'll really enjoy. Then when my son learns to read I'll >have a small gaming group available at all times...which would be paradise! >:D > My ex-wife has largely lost her enthusiasm for table top role playing, although she is still a keen LARP. My two girls are interested in table topping with me - but sibling rivalry kicks in too often and wrecks the game so I prefer playing the D&D inroductory game with them (sort of mini-HeroQuest, if anyone remembers the GW board game of that name...) which works well. Their mother is taking them both LARPing as well... Cheers, Nick Middleton From andrew at crashbox.com Fri Aug 13 23:14:53 2004 From: andrew at crashbox.com (Andrew Mellinger) Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 06:14:53 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Ambushes In-Reply-To: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C79192741094212C@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> References: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C79192741094212C@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> Message-ID: I think you could mitigate the effects of everyone having to make hide rolls if the were hiding behind/in something. I remember reading that a normal tactic is to have two watchers, and have the rest of the squad behind a wall, or whatever. Having a solid barrier helps block sounds as well. Once either of the watchers gives the signal, the entire squad opens up. In game terms this would mean two separate hide/conceal rolls. If they have time, one of the completely concealed people could go out and try to 'detect' the watchers. I don't have military experience with ambushes, except for what happened as a kid. But my limited experience tells me that if the ambushers have time, they certainly have the advantage. I'd probably give a bonus to the ambushers. Also, in game terms, are the ambushees really prepared? I can't think of how many times I've hiked throught he woods trying to pretend I was watching for amushes. Travel is really slow and after a short time, you get complacent. I can imaginge an adventuring party wouldn't do a very good job of watching day after day. I'd probably give them a penalty to their scan. -Andrew On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 Michael.Christian at corbis.com wrote: > Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 22:46:29 -0700 > From: Michael.Christian at corbis.com > Reply-To: RuneQuest rules discussion. > To: rq-rules at crashbox.com > Subject: RE: [RQ-Rules] Ambushes > >> From a realism standpoint (ex-army infantry, so ambushes are something I > know from personal experience) it seems that setting an ambush in game terms > would depend on the worst skill of the ambushing party and the best skill of > the people who could possibly detect the ambush. All it takes is one screw > up (snapped twig, cough, etc.) to completely blow an ambush. Your system > seems perfectly viable and what I would use with the above caveats. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com > [mailto:rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com]On Behalf Of The Blacklocks > Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2004 11:34 PM > To: Runequest List > Subject: [RQ-Rules] Ambushes > > > I have a question for everyone out there about ambushes. My question is > around detecting an ambush. What I have used is that one member of the > ambushing group makes a Hide roll for the group. Then when the ambushee > group comes wondering along, the point guy gets to make a Scan roll and > tries to beat the Hide roll. If successful, the point guy sees the ambush > and is able to raise the alarm. If not, hope you have some decent armour!!! > > What do other people use for ambushes? > > Thanks, > > The Northern DM > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From rico at ricosweb.com Fri Aug 13 23:30:23 2004 From: rico at ricosweb.com (Rich Allen) Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 07:30:23 -0600 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Ambushes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <200481373023.895917@laptop> On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 22:33:58 -0800, The Blacklocks wrote: >?What do other people use for ambushes? Everyone participating in the ambush makes a Hide roll, and everyone being ambushed *who is actively scanning* makes a single scan roll which is compared against all of the hide rolls. It works for my group! :) Rich Allen From jurrubin at earthlink.net Sat Aug 14 00:14:29 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 09:14:29 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Ambushes Message-ID: <22749367.1092406469260.JavaMail.root@scooter.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Sandy Peterson wrote a good article on the art of ambush. He brought up the point that even without apparent cover, an ambush can be laid through good use of seemingly open terrain. Another aspect of trying to be prepared for ambushes is that of _hyper_alertness. This condition can occur when the potential range of engagement is extremely short. On patrols in the jungles of Viet Nam where ambushes could occur at ranges as close as 10 feet, some guys would get so hyper that they'd fire at innocuous sounds. Hyperalertness can be just as much a liability as complacency. Sandy's writeup should still be findable in the list archives. If not, let me know and I'll be happy to repost it. David -----Original Message----- From: Andrew Mellinger Sent: Aug 13, 2004 8:14 AM To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." Subject: RE: [RQ-Rules] Ambushes Having a solid barrier helps block sounds as well. I don't have military experience with ambushes, except for what happened as a kid. But my limited experience tells me that if the ambushers have time, they certainly have the advantage. I'd probably give a bonus to the ambushers. Also, in game terms, are the ambushees really prepared? I can't think of how many times I've hiked throught he woods trying to pretend I was watching for amushes. Travel is really slow and after a short time, you get complacent. I can imaginge an adventuring party wouldn't do a very good job of watching day after day. I'd probably give them a penalty to their scan. From aescleal at btinternet.com Sat Aug 14 00:53:07 2004 From: aescleal at btinternet.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?ASHLEY=20MUNDAY?=) Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 15:53:07 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Ambushes In-Reply-To: <22749367.1092406469260.JavaMail.root@scooter.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20040813145307.86910.qmail@web86210.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> I've just had this vision of Sandy demonstrating the technique of hiding on an open plain. My mind has gone into boggle mode at that vision. He'd either have to stop wearing sandals or make sure his socks didn't glow. Ash --- David Smart wrote: > Sandy Peterson wrote a good article on the art of > ambush. He brought up the point that even without > apparent cover, an ambush can be laid through good > use of seemingly open terrain. > > Another aspect of trying to be prepared for ambushes > is that of _hyper_alertness. This condition can > occur when the potential range of engagement is > extremely short. On patrols in the jungles of Viet > Nam where ambushes could occur at ranges as close as > 10 feet, some guys would get so hyper that they'd > fire at innocuous sounds. > > Hyperalertness can be just as much a liability as > complacency. > > Sandy's writeup should still be findable in the list > archives. If not, let me know and I'll be happy to > repost it. > > David > > -----Original Message----- > From: Andrew Mellinger > Sent: Aug 13, 2004 8:14 AM > To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." > > Subject: RE: [RQ-Rules] Ambushes > > > > Having a solid barrier helps block sounds as > well. > > I don't have military experience with ambushes, > except for what happened > as a kid. But my limited experience tells me that > if the ambushers have > time, they certainly have the advantage. I'd > probably give a bonus to the > ambushers. > > Also, in game terms, are the ambushees really > prepared? I can't think of > how many times I've hiked throught he woods trying > to pretend I was > watching for amushes. Travel is really slow and > after a short time, you > get complacent. I can imaginge an adventuring party > wouldn't do a very > good job of watching day after day. I'd probably > give them a penalty to > their scan. > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From aelarsen at mac.com Sat Aug 14 01:46:00 2004 From: aelarsen at mac.com (Andrew Larsen) Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 10:46:00 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Zip Code In-Reply-To: <20040813053611.229E122272F@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: I'm in Madison, WI 53711. I've got a small knot of players here with me, at least 9 that I know of. Andrew E. Larsen From steve at perrinworlds.com Sun Aug 15 03:26:05 2004 From: steve at perrinworlds.com (Steve Perrin) Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2004 10:26:05 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Zip Code References: Message-ID: <006d01c48223$c83884f0$68417442@wizard> This brings up a good point. Some folks who might seem to be in the wilderness without players may be the only reps on this list. I, for one, can call on at least six players, none of whom are on this list. Any way of tracking that? Stephen H. Perrin (714) 965-1614, 92708 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Larsen" To: "Rq-Rules List" Sent: Friday, August 13, 2004 8:46 AM Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Zip Code > I'm in Madison, WI 53711. I've got a small knot of players here with me, at > least 9 that I know of. > > Andrew E. Larsen > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From freyrvanic at earthlink.net Sun Aug 15 04:02:24 2004 From: freyrvanic at earthlink.net (Sven Lugar) Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2004 11:02:24 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Zip Code Message-ID: <410-22004861418224953@earthlink.net> Perhaps if we included a count of those non-list players we host for RQ games. I've recently perverted (oops, converted) 4 players to the dark-side (oops again I mean RQ) Also, my turn at playing GM for the Sunday Night Gaming group is coming up & I hope to gain some more converts. Steve, if I put together a mini-convention for RQ & BRPS in the Los Angeles area, would you be willing to come as a guest-speaker, etc? Most of the day would be devoted to playing. Maybe even talk you into an SPQR demo game? manga takk, Sven > [Original Message] > From: Steve Perrin > To: RuneQuest rules discussion. > Date: 8/14/2004 10:26:13 AM > Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: Zip Code > > This brings up a good point. Some folks who might seem to be in the > wilderness without players may be the only reps on this list. > > I, for one, can call on at least six players, none of whom are on this list. > > Any way of tracking that? > > Stephen H. Perrin > (714) 965-1614, > 92708 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Andrew Larsen" > To: "Rq-Rules List" > Sent: Friday, August 13, 2004 8:46 AM > Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Zip Code > > > > I'm in Madison, WI 53711. I've got a small knot of players here with me, > at > > least 9 that I know of. > > > > Andrew E. Larsen > > > > _______________________________________________ > > RQ-Rules mailing list > > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From peter.brink at brinkdata.se Sun Aug 15 05:09:47 2004 From: peter.brink at brinkdata.se (Peter Brink) Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2004 21:09:47 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] How to announce fan-publications? Message-ID: <200408142109.48284.peter.brink@brinkdata.se> This post is about helping the BRP systems community communicate better. Making it easy for fan-publishers to spread the word about their stuff is very important IMO. RuneQuest wouldn't be around these days without the efforts of the fans. Without the fanzines, websites and mailing lists like this one it would be but a fading memory. In my experience producer supported websites never get as popular (or trusted) as fan managed ones. With three different RQ lists and two BRP lists, and probably quite a number of other mail-lists covering the other BRP systems, a publisher of fan produced material will need to cross-post any announcements on new or updated supplements or add-ons to a number of lists, which might be potentially annoying for the subscribers of those lists not to mention how confusing it could get for the fan publisher. Any way, I figured that it wouldn't be that difficult to put together a tool that could help people to spread the word about their fan-publications and help those rolegames who would like get such information to get that info in a painless and unobtrusive way, and I was right - it wasn't that difficult to do. I'm sure there are many other ways to solve this particular issue, quite possible several that are better than my attempt, but this is my take at it. What I've done is to set up a webforum, which has the possibility of allowing its users to subscribe to news from the different boards of the forum. It works like this: 1) A registered user posts an announcement about a new or updated fan-publication. 2) A moderator reviews the posted announcements and approves (or discards) it, if approved the post gets submitted to the board. 3) Once a day, each user, who has requested it, gets a digest of all new announcements over the last 24 hours. The user can set when his digest is too be assembled and sent to him. The user is able to subscribe to one or more boards (or no board of course), all announcements are delivered at the same time, so there's only one mail per subscriber. This is of course a completely non-commercial service, a user can at any time opt out of the delivery service and terminate his account at the webforum. The webforum has been set up at: http://www.rollspelshornan.se/brps/ It's operational but some testing wouldn't hurt... :-) So what do you think? Would it be useful to you or is it just a waste of time? From steve at perrinworlds.com Sun Aug 15 06:24:46 2004 From: steve at perrinworlds.com (Steve Perrin) Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2004 13:24:46 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Zip Code References: <410-22004861418224953@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <008c01c4823c$be43f5b0$68417442@wizard> Check dates with me (my weekends tend to be full of games but they are switchable,and many of the players in them might enjoy such a gathering) but certainly. Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sven Lugar" To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." Sent: Saturday, August 14, 2004 11:02 AM Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: Zip Code > Perhaps if we included a count of those non-list players we host for RQ > games. I've recently perverted (oops, converted) 4 players to the dark-side > (oops again I mean RQ) Also, my turn at playing GM for the Sunday Night > Gaming group is coming up & I hope to gain some more converts. > > Steve, if I put together a mini-convention for RQ & BRPS in the Los Angeles > area, would you be willing to come as a guest-speaker, etc? Most of the day > would be devoted to playing. Maybe even talk you into an SPQR demo game? > manga takk, > Sven > > > > [Original Message] > > From: Steve Perrin > > To: RuneQuest rules discussion. > > Date: 8/14/2004 10:26:13 AM > > Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Re: Zip Code > > > > This brings up a good point. Some folks who might seem to be in the > > wilderness without players may be the only reps on this list. > > > > I, for one, can call on at least six players, none of whom are on this > list. > > > > Any way of tracking that? > > > > Stephen H. Perrin > > (714) 965-1614, > > 92708 > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Andrew Larsen" > > To: "Rq-Rules List" > > Sent: Friday, August 13, 2004 8:46 AM > > Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Zip Code > > > > > > > I'm in Madison, WI 53711. I've got a small knot of players here with > me, > > at > > > least 9 that I know of. > > > > > > Andrew E. Larsen > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > RQ-Rules mailing list > > > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > > > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > > > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > RQ-Rules mailing list > > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > > > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From gianni at basicrps.com Mon Aug 16 06:32:51 2004 From: gianni at basicrps.com (Gianni) Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 22:32:51 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP In-Reply-To: <1786319f04080610451c150ceb@mail.gmail.com> References: <83.1283864b.2e451208@aol.com> <1786319f04080610451c150ceb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1092601971.411fc8730c1d7@imp.webhuset.no> > Perhaps. I still wonder whether gaming hasn't still ground itself > down, rather like Wargaming did in the early to mid eighties. Are > young, new people coming to the hobby? I am currently playing in a RQ2 campaign set in the Zola Fel valley. My GM is using the Meints reprints as well as material from the RQ3 Renaissance. I am an old time player, and so is another in the group, but the four/five other players are all newcomers to the hobbies. We are all between 30 and 40. So-- young? not really. New? definitely. Gianni From ffilz-lists at mindspring.com Tue Aug 17 07:23:29 2004 From: ffilz-lists at mindspring.com (Frank Filz) Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 14:23:29 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Location by Zip References: <660-220048412164121573@M2W061.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <018601c483d7$4a0d2800$e7c52609@IBMSKFUWSTXPIP> > I pitch in: > > 15229. (Pitt PA) just moved here. > > Who were the guys in PDX? Wish I had known before I moved away... Now that's worth a smile as I type this from downtown Pittsburgh... I'm the guy from 97006, Beaverton. I'm working here for three days between weekend vacations (last weekend in DC, next weekend at GenCon). Frank Filz From leonbk at yahoo.com Wed Aug 18 00:16:26 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 07:16:26 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Divine Magic (not Rune Magic) In-Reply-To: <20040729122632.58983.qmail@web51006.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040817141626.81142.qmail@web41110.mail.yahoo.com> Certain cults can not, or do not, have access to Spirit magic. There are also societies, which have wide variety of cults and deities do not fit in well, IMO, with the standard Spirit Magic rules. I, therefore, offer an alternative magic source for worshippers. Divine Magic It is stated that a gods power is associated to a particular set of runes, which the deity possesses, or is attuned to. Rune spells granted to his worshippers are therefore. a reflection of that power. In a similar way Divine spells are a reflection of the Rune spells a character knows. Divine spells act and look in all respects as standard Spirit magic spells, but are derived from the knowledge of a Rune spell. Each Rune spell known to a character allows the character to cast a particular Divine spell, which is similar in function to the Rune spell, but is of course weaker nature. If a character looses or casts the Rune spell, he would be unable to cast the corresponding divine spell until the Rune spell is re-sacrificed or re-prayed for. As a general rule, each point of Rune magic allows the user to cast a 2pt Divine spell. Stackable Rune spells make for higher Divine spells and certain Rune spells are reflected as multiple Divine spells. For example a knowledge of Shield would allow the character to cast a Protection or a Countermagic. There are a number of issues with this, which are yet to be ironed out, and I would like some input, as well as, questions from you guys in order so we can iron things out. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now. http://messenger.yahoo.com From leonbk at yahoo.com Wed Aug 18 00:28:22 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 07:28:22 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Alternate Earth - Mesopotamia suppliment In-Reply-To: <20040729122632.58983.qmail@web51006.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040817142822.70466.qmail@web41114.mail.yahoo.com> For those of you who are interested in the Alternate Earth settings check out the Ancient Kingdom of Mesopotamia suppliment by Necromancer Games. (http://www.necromancergames.com/) I found it to be very interesting and it looks very adaptable to BFR. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From peter.brink at brinkdata.se Wed Aug 18 00:53:59 2004 From: peter.brink at brinkdata.se (Peter Brink) Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 16:53:59 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Alternate Earth - Mesopotamia suppliment References: <20040817142822.70466.qmail@web41114.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <008001c4846a$09a9cfa0$9d2aa8c0@skadebyran.se> On Tuesday, August 17, 2004 4:28 PM, Leon Kirshtein wrote: > For those of you who are interested in the Alternate > Earth settings check out the Ancient Kingdom of > Mesopotamia suppliment by Necromancer Games. > (http://www.necromancergames.com/) > > I found it to be very interesting and it looks very > adaptable to BFR. > > ===== > Leon Kirshtein > www.godlearner.d2g.com > For a similar game check out http://www.eyeballkid.co.za/zenobia.html and also: http://www.geocities.com/zozergames/zenobia.html Should be easy to adapt to BRP. From jurrubin at earthlink.net Wed Aug 18 11:21:44 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 20:21:44 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <21411944.1092792104969.JavaMail.root@grover.psp.pas.earthlink.net> In RQIII, does the Sense Projection spell allow a sorceror to project any sense or does he need to learn a separate spell for each sense? David From Michael.Christian at corbis.com Wed Aug 18 11:50:52 2004 From: Michael.Christian at corbis.com (Michael.Christian at corbis.com) Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 18:50:52 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C791927410942153@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> In the games I've played in and run it's always been a separate spell for each sense. It also seems to be the way the general RQ mechanics seem to work throughout all of the magic systems to have the larger spell type (summon, sense projection, enhance, tap, etc.) then the modifier that makes that spell more specific (creature, sense, attribute, etc.). -----Original Message----- From: rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com [mailto:rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com]On Behalf Of David Smart Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 6:22 PM To: RuneQuest rules discussion. Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question In RQIII, does the Sense Projection spell allow a sorceror to project any sense or does he need to learn a separate spell for each sense? David _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From jurrubin at earthlink.net Wed Aug 18 11:56:15 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 20:56:15 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <25619067.1092794175635.JavaMail.root@grover.psp.pas.earthlink.net> That's what I thought. Thanks for the confirmation. David -----Original Message----- From: Michael.Christian at corbis.com Sent: Aug 17, 2004 8:50 PM To: jurrubin at earthlink.net, rq-rules at crashbox.com Subject: RE: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question In the games I've played in and run it's always been a separate spell for each sense. It also seems to be the way the general RQ mechanics seem to work throughout all of the magic systems to have the larger spell type (summon, sense projection, enhance, tap, etc.) then the modifier that makes that spell more specific (creature, sense, attribute, etc.). From jurrubin at earthlink.net Wed Aug 18 12:08:35 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 21:08:35 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <2563158.1092794915102.JavaMail.root@grover.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Ok, here's another. Does a Sense Projection spell require open space to be moved through or can it be moved through solid rock, given it has a standard movement rate that the sorceror can time. David From baron_greystone at hotmail.com Wed Aug 18 11:33:52 2004 From: baron_greystone at hotmail.com (Baron Greystone) Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 18:33:52 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RE: Zip Code In-Reply-To: <20040818012209.77EC72226DD@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: Wow, I'd really like to attend a mini-convention! Baron Greystone > Steve, if I put together a mini-convention for RQ & BRPS in the Los Angeles > area, would you be willing to come as a guest-speaker, etc? Most of the day > would be devoted to playing. Maybe even talk you into an SPQR demo game? > manga takk, > Sven From Michael.Christian at corbis.com Wed Aug 18 12:29:29 2004 From: Michael.Christian at corbis.com (Michael.Christian at corbis.com) Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 19:29:29 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C791927410942154@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> It seems more "sorcerous" for it to be able to go anywhere. Wizards and witches with crystal balls spying on far away people and so forth. On the other hand this leaves quite a bit of room for abuse with highly boosted range and duration. As a game mechanic it might be better to not let it go through solids. It seems like if it could go through solids it could be a real spoiler for either PC or gamemaster depending on who was doing the projecting. Alternately you could determine that the projection was a physical representation of whatever sense was being projected - an invisible eyeball, ear, nose, hand sized thing and allow it to go through very small spaces but not through complete solids. You would also have to decide how this projection was effected by gravity and whether it could fly through windows or to the moon or whatever. -----Original Message----- From: rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com [mailto:rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com]On Behalf Of David Smart Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 7:09 PM To: David Smart; RuneQuest rules discussion.; RuneQuest rules discussion. Subject: RE: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Ok, here's another. Does a Sense Projection spell require open space to be moved through or can it be moved through solid rock, given it has a standard movement rate that the sorceror can time. David _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From Michael.Christian at corbis.com Wed Aug 18 13:08:01 2004 From: Michael.Christian at corbis.com (Michael.Christian at corbis.com) Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 20:08:01 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C791927410942157@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> It seems more "sorcerous" for it to be able to go anywhere. Wizards and witches with crystal balls spying on far away people and so forth. On the other hand this leaves quite a bit of room for abuse with highly boosted range and duration. As a game mechanic it might be better to not let it go through solids. It seems like if it could go through solids it could be a real spoiler for either PC or gamemaster depending on who was doing the projecting. Alternately you could determine that the projection was a physical representation of whatever sense was being projected - an invisible eyeball, ear, nose, hand sized thing and allow it to go through very small spaces but not through complete solids. You would also have to decide how this projection was effected by gravity and whether it could fly through windows or to the moon or whatever. -----Original Message----- From: rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com [mailto:rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com]On Behalf Of David Smart Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 7:09 PM To: David Smart; RuneQuest rules discussion.; RuneQuest rules discussion. Subject: RE: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Ok, here's another. Does a Sense Projection spell require open space to be moved through or can it be moved through solid rock, given it has a standard movement rate that the sorceror can time. David _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From slposey at concentric.net Wed Aug 18 13:18:50 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 20:18:50 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Alternate Earth - Mesopotamia suppliment In-Reply-To: <008001c4846a$09a9cfa0$9d2aa8c0@skadebyran.se> References: <20040817142822.70466.qmail@web41114.mail.yahoo.com> <008001c4846a$09a9cfa0$9d2aa8c0@skadebyran.se> Message-ID: <4122CA9A.3080501@concentric.net> Peter Brink wrote: > On Tuesday, August 17, 2004 4:28 PM, > Leon Kirshtein wrote: > > >>For those of you who are interested in the Alternate >>Earth settings check out the Ancient Kingdom of >>Mesopotamia suppliment by Necromancer Games. >>(http://www.necromancergames.com/) >> >>I found it to be very interesting and it looks very >>adaptable to BFR. It's on my "to be acquired list", every review I've seen of it has been very good. Not sure whether it's been mentioned on the list before, but in a similar vein, Mongoose Publishing's "OGL Ancients" game: http://www.mongoosepublishing.com/home/detail.php?qsID=347&qsSeries=3 is also quite good. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From slposey at concentric.net Wed Aug 18 13:24:45 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 20:24:45 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RE: Zip Code In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4122CBFD.8010302@concentric.net> Baron Greystone wrote: > Wow, I'd really like to attend a mini-convention! > Baron Greystone > > >>Steve, if I put together a mini-convention for RQ & BRPS in the Los > Angeles >>area, would you be willing to come as a guest-speaker, etc? Most of the > day >>would be devoted to playing. Maybe even talk you into an SPQR demo game? >>manga takk, >>Sven Vegas is close enough to LA that I could probably come for something like that too, so please keep me posted if that evolves. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From comogatas at yahoo.com Wed Aug 18 17:04:56 2004 From: comogatas at yahoo.com (Eddy) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 00:04:56 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ mini-con LA Message-ID: <20040818070456.34775.qmail@web40507.mail.yahoo.com> keep me posted and I'll try and make it to any RQ mini-con you guys come up with in the LA area. I still haven't heard back from the other Oxnard guy yet. Eddy --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! From freyrvanic at earthlink.net Wed Aug 18 17:52:23 2004 From: freyrvanic at earthlink.net (Sven Lugar) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 00:52:23 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ mini-con LA Message-ID: <410-22004831875223265@earthlink.net> >From the several posts, I suspect there is support for the idea, so I have begun looking for a reasonable priced site. Are there any requisites that folks need, or events they would wish to see? manga takk, Sven --------------------------------------------------------------------------- responses include: Wow, I'd really like to attend a mini-convention! Baron Greystone also: Vegas is close enough to LA that I could probably come for something like that too, so please keep me posted if that evolves. Stephen Posey also: keep me posted and I'll try and make it to any RQ mini-con you guys come up with in the LA area. I still haven't heard back from the other Oxnard guy yet. Eddy _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From soltakss at yahoo.com Wed Aug 18 22:50:40 2004 From: soltakss at yahoo.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?Simon=20Phipp?=) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 13:50:40 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Something useful on the Glorantha digest Message-ID: <20040818125040.20320.qmail@web51005.mail.yahoo.com> Hiya All Against all the odds, something useful has popped up on the Gloranthan Digest :-) > Message: 2 > Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 09:10:45 -0700 > From: greg at glorantha.com > To: glorantha at rpglist.org > Subject: [Glorantha]Trademarks, the official word > Reply-To: glorantha at rpglist.org > > Dear Friends, > > > From: Warren Creighton asks > > > Did Greg ever have the trademark ? I thought it might > > have been a trademark of Chaosium ? > > It was, but it was sold to Avalon HIll, who sold it to Hasbro, who let it > lapse > so that Issaries reclaimed it. > > > What > > value is there in having a trademark that was part a > > game system, now out of print, and owned by someone > > else? > > The recognition value is tremendous. A lot of people who do not know > HeroQuest > know RuneQuest. To many people RuneQuest = Glorantha. > And oh yea, the sentimental value is tremendous too. > > > My question is > > now that he has it, what will be done with it? > > We will be using it on various products that could be used with the old > RuneQuest books. I have even considered putting it on the HeroQuest line, > to > indicate the connections. > If anyone has other suggestions, send them to me privately, please. > > > What does all this mean for Glorantha and Runequest ? > > We have been talking with Chaosium about the possibility of licensing the > RQ TM > to them to use with a version of BRP to fill out their fantasy line. > Issaries > does not plan to release a version of the RQ game ourselves. Although I > love > the game dearly, I find the system to be archaic and not capable of > representing the entirety of Glorantha as well as HeroQuest. > > > Who owns the trademark for Glorantha ? > > Issaries, does, through usage, etc. And we have finally applied officially > for > it as well to cement the facts. > > I hope that this presents the facts satisfactorily. > > - Greg Stafford Now, isn't that interesting? Simon ___________________________________________________________ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From aescleal at btinternet.com Wed Aug 18 23:15:54 2004 From: aescleal at btinternet.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?ASHLEY=20MUNDAY?=) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 14:15:54 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Something useful on the Glorantha digest In-Reply-To: <20040818125040.20320.qmail@web51005.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040818131554.62673.qmail@web86203.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> I hope when he says "licenses" he's not interested in too much money to make it worth Chaosium's while. Don't suppose anyone knows what happened over the (quite cheeky) attempt by Chaosium to trademark Glorantha? Cheers, Ash --- Simon Phipp wrote: > Hiya All > > Against all the odds, something useful has popped up > on the Gloranthan Digest > :-) > > > Message: 2 > > Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 09:10:45 -0700 > > From: greg at glorantha.com > > To: glorantha at rpglist.org > > Subject: [Glorantha]Trademarks, the official word > > Reply-To: glorantha at rpglist.org > > > > Dear Friends, > > > > > From: Warren Creighton > asks > > > > > Did Greg ever have the trademark ? I thought it > might > > > have been a trademark of Chaosium ? > > > > It was, but it was sold to Avalon HIll, who sold > it to Hasbro, who let it > > lapse > > so that Issaries reclaimed it. > > > > > What > > > value is there in having a trademark that was > part a > > > game system, now out of print, and owned by > someone > > > else? > > > > The recognition value is tremendous. A lot of > people who do not know > > HeroQuest > > know RuneQuest. To many people RuneQuest = > Glorantha. > > And oh yea, the sentimental value is tremendous > too. > > > > > My question is > > > now that he has it, what will be done with it? > > > > We will be using it on various products that could > be used with the old > > RuneQuest books. I have even considered putting it > on the HeroQuest line, > > to > > indicate the connections. > > If anyone has other suggestions, send them to me > privately, please. > > > > > What does all this mean for Glorantha and > Runequest ? > > > > We have been talking with Chaosium about the > possibility of licensing the > > RQ TM > > to them to use with a version of BRP to fill out > their fantasy line. > > Issaries > > does not plan to release a version of the RQ game > ourselves. Although I > > love > > the game dearly, I find the system to be archaic > and not capable of > > representing the entirety of Glorantha as well as > HeroQuest. > > > > > Who owns the trademark for Glorantha ? > > > > Issaries, does, through usage, etc. And we have > finally applied officially > > for > > it as well to cement the facts. > > > > I hope that this presents the facts > satisfactorily. > > > > - Greg Stafford > > Now, isn't that interesting? > > Simon > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ALL-NEW > Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From soltakss at yahoo.com Wed Aug 18 22:45:18 2004 From: soltakss at yahoo.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?Simon=20Phipp?=) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 13:45:18 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Alternate Earth, Sense Projection In-Reply-To: <20040818012209.77EC72226DD@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: <20040818124518.46410.qmail@web51007.mail.yahoo.com> Leon Kirshtein: > For those of you who are interested in the Alternate > Earth settings check out the Ancient Kingdom of > Mesopotamia suppliment by Necromancer Games. > (http://www.necromancergames.com/) > > I found it to be very interesting and it looks very > adaptable to BFR. and Peter Brink: > For a similar game check out http://www.eyeballkid.co.za/zenobia.html > and also: http://www.geocities.com/zozergames/zenobia.html > Should be easy to adapt to BRP. I'll have to add the links to the Alternate Earth group. Simon David Smart: > In RQIII, does the Sense Projection spell allow a sorceror to project any > sense or does he need to learn a separate spell for each sense? We played that each sense had its own (Sense) Projection spell. Simon ___________________________________________________________ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From leonbk at yahoo.com Wed Aug 18 23:37:56 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 06:37:56 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Alternate Earth, Sense Projection In-Reply-To: <20040818124518.46410.qmail@web51007.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040818133756.47499.qmail@web41110.mail.yahoo.com> --- Simon Phipp wrote: > I'll have to add the links to the Alternate Earth > group. I am sorry if I missed it before, but what is the address for this group? ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From lorgryt.detroll at verizon.net Thu Aug 19 00:58:25 2004 From: lorgryt.detroll at verizon.net (Bo Whitten) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 07:58:25 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Alternate Earth, Sense Projection In-Reply-To: <20040818133756.47499.qmail@web41110.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040818124518.46410.qmail@web51007.mail.yahoo.com> <20040818133756.47499.qmail@web41110.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20040818075708.02123fc8@incoming.verizon.net> At 06:37 AM 8/18/2004, you wrote: >--- Simon Phipp wrote: >> I'll have to add the links to the Alternate Earth >> group. > > >I am sorry if I missed it before, but what is the >address for this group? > >===== >Leon Kirshtein >www.godlearner.d2g.com http://geocities.com/alternateearthrq That should get you there. Bo From peter.brink at brinkdata.se Thu Aug 19 01:28:17 2004 From: peter.brink at brinkdata.se (Peter Brink) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 17:28:17 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Something useful on the Glorantha digest In-Reply-To: <20040818131554.62673.qmail@web86203.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <20040818131554.62673.qmail@web86203.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200408181728.18124.peter.brink@brinkdata.se> onsdag 18 augusti 2004 15:15 skrev ASHLEY MUNDAY: > I hope when he says "licenses" he's not interested in > too much money to make it worth Chaosium's while. > > Don't suppose anyone knows what happened over the > (quite cheeky) attempt by Chaosium to trademark > Glorantha? > Cheeky? :-) Personally I find Issaries' claim on RuneQuest a bit cheeky... :-) Both Issaries and Chaosium are in the beginning stage of their respective trademark registration processes. So the situation is that Chaosium has the trademark "Glorantha" registered and Issaries don't. Personally I would prefer that Chaosium owned "RuneQuest" and Issaries owned "Glorantha. A RQ logo on a HeroQuest product that contained no RQ rules material would be like stamping "can be used with trucks" sign on a bicycle wheel, while theoretically true it takes quite a bit of work, on behalf of the customer, to make it roll. From phil.hibbs at capgemini.com Thu Aug 19 02:20:04 2004 From: phil.hibbs at capgemini.com (Hibbs, Phil) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 17:20:04 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E9826A@exast02.capgemini.co.uk> >Ok, here's another. Does a Sense Projection spell require >open space to be moved through or can it be moved through >solid rock, given it has a standard movement rate that the >sorceror can time. I had a sorceror in my game that made extensive use of Project Sight, so here are the rules that we came up with (some of which may be backed up by the RQ3 rules, but mostly not): The projection is about the size of a tennis ball. It cannot move through physical objects. It cannot enter a POW aura except the caster's. Wardings hit the caster if the projection crosses them, but not if it goes around them. Going over them never occurred to us, but I would probably not let him get away with that. If it is drawn into the caster's POW aura, then it can travel with him (this is the only way to avoid leaving it behind). If the caster is dragged off while the projection is away from his body, the spell would drop when it goes out of range. It is visible to any user of Mystic Vision, Second Sight (and therefore any shaman), or Soul Sight. See my "Scrying Device" enchantment (for Sandy's sorcery) for more sensory projection fun. http://www.snark.freeserve.co.uk/extrasorcery.html Phil Hibbs Our name has changed. Please update your address book to the following format: "recipient at capgemini.com". This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. From comogatas at yahoo.com Thu Aug 19 11:11:59 2004 From: comogatas at yahoo.com (Eddy) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 18:11:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 Message-ID: <20040819011159.95367.qmail@web40510.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Guys, long time listener, first time caller... I have never had the opportunity to play RQ, however I understand that RQ2 incremented the skill percentiles by 5 for character advancement, while RQ3 (which is the only RQ I have) takes into account individual percentile points. My real question has to do with generic task resolution systems and whether any of you seasoned RQ rules tweakers have thought about using a different die type for task resolution (d20, d6, 3d6, d10, whatever) or does some other part of RQ make that difficult to do. My idea is that if the RQ %system could be converted to using a D20 instead (NOT the D20 system, just the die) then it would be easier to attract (non-BRP gamers) and it might speed play. My other thought for using the D20 is that it's easier to scale (strictly my opinion) when designing rules. I should be upfront and say that I also am also trying to write a very basic set of rules based on BRP/RQ but using a D20 and making the base characteristics (except for size) zero neutral. And I like math. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now. From ghoyle1 at sbcglobal.net Thu Aug 19 11:15:07 2004 From: ghoyle1 at sbcglobal.net (Guy Hoyle) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 20:15:07 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 In-Reply-To: <20040819011159.95367.qmail@web40510.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040819011159.95367.qmail@web40510.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4123FF1B.4040406@sbcglobal.net> Eddy wrote: >Hi Guys, long time listener, first time caller... > >I have never had the opportunity to play RQ, however I understand that RQ2 incremented the skill percentiles by 5 for character advancement, while RQ3 (which is the only RQ I have) takes into account individual percentile points. My real question has to do with generic task resolution systems and whether any of you seasoned RQ rules tweakers have thought about using a different die type for task resolution (d20, d6, 3d6, d10, whatever) or does some other part of RQ make that difficult to do. My idea is that if the RQ %system could be converted to using a D20 instead (NOT the D20 system, just the die) then it would be easier to attract (non-BRP gamers) and it might speed play. My other thought for using the D20 is that it's easier to scale (strictly my opinion) when designing rules. I should be upfront and say that I also am also trying to write a very basic set of rules based on BRP/RQ but using a D20 and making the base characteristics (except for size) zero neutral. And > I like > math. > > Pendragon is based on BRP and uses a D20, you might want to check that out. Guy (Hoyle) From DevinC at aol.com Thu Aug 19 12:08:20 2004 From: DevinC at aol.com (DevinC at aol.com) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 22:08:20 EDT Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 Message-ID: <1ea.28212891.2e556594@aol.com> In a message dated 8/18/2004 6:12:23 PM Pacific Daylight Time, comogatas at yahoo.com writes: <> I honestly can't imagine a system more intuitive than a percentile system. We already think in terms of percentage whenever we think about our chances do do something. Converting this to a DX system simply imposes a second layer of math atop the percentile system. Devin From freyrvanic at earthlink.net Thu Aug 19 12:16:20 2004 From: freyrvanic at earthlink.net (Sven Lugar) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 19:16:20 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 Message-ID: <410-22004841921620906@earthlink.net> This is what they did as the basis for Pendragon & a couple of other game incarnations. I like the variance of Runequest personally. However you can get a feel for how it resolves if you go to my Pendragon pages http://home.earthlink.net/~freyrvanic/Pendragon.html. Read Bercilak's adventures as well which is a game in progress. Also compare over to my Runequest page http://home.earthlink.net/~freyrvanic/Gaming.html. Off my home page you'll find stuff about the other wierd things I do including fighting. Sven > [Original Message] > From: Eddy > To: RQ-Rules Digest > Date: 8/18/2004 6:12:04 PM > Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 > > Hi Guys, long time listener, first time caller... > > I have never had the opportunity to play RQ, however I understand that RQ2 incremented the skill percentiles by 5 for character advancement, while RQ3 (which is the only RQ I have) takes into account individual percentile points. My real question has to do with generic task resolution systems and whether any of you seasoned RQ rules tweakers have thought about using a different die type for task resolution (d20, d6, 3d6, d10, whatever) or does some other part of RQ make that difficult to do. My idea is that if the RQ %system could be converted to using a D20 instead (NOT the D20 system, just the die) then it would be easier to attract (non-BRP gamers) and it might speed play. My other thought for using the D20 is that it's easier to scale (strictly my opinion) when designing rules. I should be upfront and say that I also am also trying to write a very basic set of rules based on BRP/RQ but using a D20 and making the base characteristics (except for size) zero neutral. And > I like > math. > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now. > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From steve at perrinworlds.com Thu Aug 19 13:38:44 2004 From: steve at perrinworlds.com (Steve Perrin) Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 20:38:44 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 References: <410-22004841921620906@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <009901c4859e$178510a0$68417442@wizard> My current project is FANGS (Fantasy Area Network Gaming System - don't ask), a game I am working on for Chris Allen, the head honcho of Skotos.net. If one goes to Skotos and is diligent, one can find FANGS somewhere, though the copy you will see is a bit behind the times. Chris developed the game from BRP and changed it to D20, then tossed it to me to continue with (paying me, of course). I have been running a campaign of it locally, and would be glad to show it off at that LARQ Con Sven is talking about. If anyone has any further interest, just contact me off list. There is no real intent to ever charge for the game, so I am sure Chris wouldn't mind some more playtesting. Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sven Lugar" To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 7:16 PM Subject: RE: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 > This is what they did as the basis for Pendragon & a couple of other game incarnations. I like the variance of Runequest personally. However you can get a feel for how it resolves if you go to my Pendragon pages http://home.earthlink.net/~freyrvanic/Pendragon.html. Read Bercilak's adventures as well which is a game in progress. Also compare over to my Runequest page http://home.earthlink.net/~freyrvanic/Gaming.html. Off my home page you'll find stuff about the other wierd things I do including fighting. > Sven > > > > [Original Message] > > From: Eddy > > To: RQ-Rules Digest > > Date: 8/18/2004 6:12:04 PM > > Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 > > > > Hi Guys, long time listener, first time caller... > > > > I have never had the opportunity to play RQ, however I understand that RQ2 incremented the skill percentiles by 5 for character advancement, while RQ3 (which is the only RQ I have) takes into account individual percentile points. My real question has to do with generic task resolution systems and whether any of you seasoned RQ rules tweakers have thought about using a different die type for task resolution (d20, d6, 3d6, d10, whatever) or does some other part of RQ make that difficult to do. My idea is that if the RQ %system could be converted to using a D20 instead (NOT the D20 system, just the die) then it would be easier to attract (non-BRP gamers) and it might speed play. My other thought for using the D20 is that it's easier to scale (strictly my opinion) when designing rules. I should be upfront and say that I also am also trying to write a very basic set of rules based on BRP/RQ but using a D20 and making the base characteristics (except for size) zero neutral. A > nd > > I like > > math. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now. > > _______________________________________________ > > RQ-Rules mailing list > > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From soltakss at yahoo.com Thu Aug 19 22:17:07 2004 From: soltakss at yahoo.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?Simon=20Phipp?=) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 13:17:07 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Sorcery Question In-Reply-To: <20040818131626.354A62226EE@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: <20040819121707.22279.qmail@web51010.mail.yahoo.com> David Smart: > Ok, here's another. Does a Sense Projection spell require open space to be > moved through or can it be moved through solid rock, given it has a > standard > movement rate that the sorceror can time. and Michael Christian: > It seems more "sorcerous" for it to be able to go anywhere. Wizards and > witches with crystal balls spying on far away people and so forth. > > On the other hand this leaves quite a bit of room for abuse with highly > boosted range and duration. As a game mechanic it might be better to not > let > it go through solids. It seems like if it could go through solids it could > be a real spoiler for either PC or gamemaster depending on who was doing > the > projecting. We played that it could pass through solid objects etc. but this took a Concentration roll each round it passes through solids/liquids. So, if it passess through an earthen floor and takes 2 rounds to do so then the sorcerer must make 2 concentration (INTx3) rolls. > Alternately you could determine that the projection was a physical > representation of whatever sense was being projected - an invisible > eyeball, > ear, nose, hand sized thing and allow it to go through very small spaces > but > not through complete solids. You would also have to decide how this > projection was effected by gravity and whether it could fly through windows > or to the moon or whatever. We played that the spell created a visible copy of the organ - an eye, tongue, ear, nose or hand. Darksense Projection had an ear and a mouth, thankfully nobody used Balance Projection or Elfsense Projection. We also played that if the organ could be seen then it could be attacked or targeted by spells, with the damage going straight tot he organ concerned. So, if someone fired an arrow at a Sight Projection's eye, the damage would affect the sorcerer, spells could protect against the damage. Of course, the spell would be hard to hit (-75 perhaps). Casting Fear, Madness or similar spells at projected senses is a useful deterrent. Being attacked in this way causes the sorcerer to make a concentration roll, so the spell could go down with no damage being done. Simon ___________________________________________________________ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From jurrubin at earthlink.net Thu Aug 19 23:53:09 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 08:53:09 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <18568654.1092923589152.JavaMail.root@bigbird.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Thanks, everyone, for your public and private replies to my questions on the use of Projection. I've received lots of great advice and have seen where I can tighten up the spell description for better balance while allowing my players to still be innovative in its use. Many thanks! David From grogthing at yahoo.com Fri Aug 20 00:14:18 2004 From: grogthing at yahoo.com (grogthing) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 07:14:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 In-Reply-To: <009901c4859e$178510a0$68417442@wizard> Message-ID: <20040819141418.94456.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> Switch from D% to D20? Why? I am writing a game that is strictly D% (abilities as well as skills) kind of a customized blend of BRP and the old FASA Star Trek system, because I feel D% percentile is easier to understand than any other numbering/rating system. Percentile evaluation is ingrained in our language as a way to communicate the chance of success to someone. You've got a 50%/50% chance. I'm 100% sure about that. Greg ===== "I have sworn, upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." - Thomas Jefferson "It does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." - Thomas Jefferson "Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry "A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious." - Aristotle _______________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Win 1 of 4,000 free domain names from Yahoo! Enter now. http://promotions.yahoo.com/goldrush From andrew at crashbox.com Fri Aug 20 01:40:00 2004 From: andrew at crashbox.com (Andrew Mellinger) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 08:40:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 In-Reply-To: <20040819011159.95367.qmail@web40510.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040819011159.95367.qmail@web40510.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I had these exact same thoughts a few years ago. I've been working on my own home-brew RPG based on RQ (currenlty at 220 pages and counting) and a few years back we decided to switch to a d20. We have found the d20 to be easier to deal with, and the math faster to work with. After much play, we have decided that the simple adds and subtracts (e.g +3 vs +15%) are much better. So basically, the sustem is percentile, but everything is done in increments of 5%. We have a few major hurdles to overcome like multiple successes. We use multiple successes like Stever Perrin not Specials and Criticals so we can easily support hero-level characters (skills in the 100% plus ranges.) Anyway, once we converted these things and some other basics (skill advancement based on difficulty) we been really happy with it. -Andrew On Wed, 18 Aug 2004, Eddy wrote: > Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 18:11:59 -0700 (PDT) > From: Eddy > Reply-To: RuneQuest rules discussion. > To: RQ-Rules Digest > Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 > > Hi Guys, long time listener, first time caller... > > I have never had the opportunity to play RQ, however I understand that RQ2 incremented the skill percentiles by 5 for character advancement, while RQ3 (which is the only RQ I have) takes into account individual percentile points. My real question has to do with generic task resolution systems and whether any of you seasoned RQ rules tweakers have thought about using a different die type for task resolution (d20, d6, 3d6, d10, whatever) or does some other part of RQ make that difficult to do. My idea is that if the RQ %system could be converted to using a D20 instead (NOT the D20 system, just the die) then it would be easier to attract (non-BRP gamers) and it might speed play. My other thought for using the D20 is that it's easier to scale (strictly my opinion) when designing rules. I should be upfront and say that I also am also trying to write a very basic set of rules based on BRP/RQ but using a D20 and making the base characteristics (except for size) zero neutral. And I like > math. > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now. > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From andrew at crashbox.com Fri Aug 20 01:51:43 2004 From: andrew at crashbox.com (Andrew Mellinger) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 08:51:43 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 In-Reply-To: <20040819141418.94456.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040819141418.94456.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Aug 2004, grogthing wrote: > Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 07:14:18 -0700 (PDT) > From: grogthing > Reply-To: RuneQuest rules discussion. > To: RuneQuest rules discussion. > Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 > > Switch from D% to D20? Why? > > I am writing a game that is strictly D% (abilities as > well as skills) kind of a customized blend of BRP and > the old FASA Star Trek system, because I feel D% > percentile is easier to understand than any other > numbering/rating system. > > Percentile evaluation is ingrained in our language as > a way to communicate the chance of success to someone. > > You've got a 50%/50% chance. I'm 100% sure about that. Before I get into my real point I want to mention that a lot of people are better at odds (1 in 10 or 1 in 6) than numbers liks 31%. I used to argue this as well, but I've changed my tune over the years, here's why. Because everyone understands percentiles, they immediately think they know what it means. "I have a 50 in my skill so I should be able to hit the guy one out of every two times." But under what conditions and when? All of a sudden the guy can dodge and you're not hitting any more. So the 50/50 doesn't really matter. What we found (and believe me when I say this) was that players (of all levels) we misled about the context of that skill level. Once you add in any other factors, which are always there, you've lost that level of understanding. When we switch to D20 we created a skill mapping to description. (Got the idea from RQ AiG). 3 = Noveice 6 = Student 9 = Trained 12 = Skilled 15 = Expert 18 = Master We then made sure to design, describe and calibrate every skill so that people can do what they expect a person of that skill level to be able to do. Obviously, there is disagreement about this too, but a lot less than about what a number means. So when a person has a skill of 12 and they are trying to do something, they think "Should a skilled person be able to do that." Or a master (18) with some wounds is now at a skill of 12. He knows he is fighting as effectively as someone who is skilled. When we design a new skill, we say "What should somebody who is skilled be able to accomplish?" Also, we have tables to show training time to skill. We can determine what the average starting level for some based off of training is. Thus we can say "A person who had this many weeks of training can do this." We convert the weeks to skill level (from out table) then use that skill level to drive the definition of the skill. Players really seem to like the Trained, Skilled, Expert verbage and relate to it very well. -Andrew From slposey at concentric.net Fri Aug 20 02:35:41 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 09:35:41 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question In-Reply-To: <18568654.1092923589152.JavaMail.root@bigbird.psp.pas.earthlink.net> References: <18568654.1092923589152.JavaMail.root@bigbird.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <4124D6DD.8060500@concentric.net> David Smart wrote: > Thanks, everyone, for your public and private replies to my questions on the > use of Projection. I've received lots of great advice and have seen > where I can tighten up the spell description for better balance while allowing > my players to still be innovative in its use. I, for one, would like to see your "tightened up" spell description, whenever you get it together. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From carpgachair at yahoo.com Fri Aug 20 03:12:32 2004 From: carpgachair at yahoo.com (Paul Cardwell) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 10:12:32 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 In-Reply-To: <410-22004841921620906@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20040819171232.95347.qmail@web51305.mail.yahoo.com> > > [Original Message] > > From: Eddy > > To: RQ-Rules Digest > > Date: 8/18/2004 6:12:04 PM > > Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and > the dreaded D20 > > > > Hi Guys, long time listener, first time caller... > > > > I have never had the opportunity to play RQ, > however I understand that RQ2 incremented the skill > percentiles by 5 for character advancement, while > RQ3 (which is the only RQ I have) takes into account > individual percentile points. My real question has > to do with generic task resolution systems and > whether any of you seasoned RQ rules tweakers have > thought about using a different die type for task > resolution (d20, d6, 3d6, d10, whatever) or does > some other part of RQ make that difficult to do. My > idea is that if the RQ %system could be converted to > using a D20 instead (NOT the D20 system, just the > die) then it would be easier to attract (non-BRP > gamers) and it might speed play. My other thought > for using the D20 is that it's easier to scale > (strictly my opinion) when designing rules. I should > be upfront and say that I also am also trying to > write a very basic set of rules based on BRP/RQ but > using a D20 and making the base characteristics > (except for size) zero neutral. Back in 1984, when Greg and I diverted our paths to a new RQ, resulting in Mythworld, I offered to referee a demo of RQ3 at Origins that year. He sent me a photocopied version of RQ3 to use. I was surprised when I started reading it of all the changes from RQ2 that I had made in Mythworld, none of which were discussed when we were working together. However, as I got into RQ3, I saw that these were about the only changes on which we agreed. I found that RQ2 advancement was too rapid with 5% increments, and so went to the individual percent (with 2 percentage points gained if the learning roll was specialed and 5 points if criticaled), the same as RQ3. This is not a problem, even if one is not proficient in math (my problem too). The figures for special and critical are on the character sheet, and so can be checked as easily as the character's basic ability. The figures are also available in the Rules book, on the same page as the fumbles, making it an easy reference for general skills as well as weapons skills. In the current (1985) version of Mythworld, this happens to be on page 42, generating references to "life, the universe, and everything"! :-) However, the current expansion of Mythworld ensures that this data will be on a less auspicious page when completed. At least the advancement rate is just right, and there have been no math problems encountered - unless you count the high school testplayer of the original who suddenly started making A in math where before he never got above C. It turned out that he was finally understanding what numbers were, rather than regurgitating rote-learned tables. Paul Cardwell __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From jurrubin at earthlink.net Fri Aug 20 04:05:39 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 13:05:39 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <17274669.1092938739212.JavaMail.root@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> From: Stephen Posey David Smart wrote: > Thanks, everyone, for your public and private replies to my questions on the > use of Projection. I've received lots of great advice and have seen > where I can tighten up the spell description for better balance while allowing > my players to still be innovative in its use. I, for one, would like to see your "tightened up" spell description, whenever you get it together. ------------------------- Certainly! Here is what I've written so far. David --- spell description begins --- SENSE PROJECTION Ranged, Active, Temporal Using this spell the magician can extend the specified sense anywhere within range of the spell. This spell forms a point from which the sense receives. This viewpoint is a small spot 10cm. across and can be moved 1 meter per Strike Rank. The viewpoint can pass through solid objects and liquids (walls, stone, water, etc. but not rain) but such movement requires a Concentration roll every 5 full Strike Ranks (drop all fractions) it passes through such a dense medium. A Concentration failure causes the spell to fail and the sorceror loses all MPs used in the casting of the spell. Example: Thoth Amon, sitting in a cave, wants to move his Sight Projection viewpoint up into a cave above him. The viewpoint must pass through 11 meters of solid rock and a 2 meter-deep underground stream to reach the open air in the target cave. At one meter per Strike Rank, it takes him 13 Strike Ranks to accomplish this, requiring 13/5 or 2 (drop fractions) Concentration rolls. The spell viewpoint can also cross a Warding from outside of it but the caster takes damage and triggers the Warding's alarms as if he himself physically moved through the Warding. Spell viewpoints can cross a Warding from the inside without triggering the Warding, just like any other spell can. The magician will be able to use his normal sense skills, such as Search, Scan, Listen, etc., depending on the sense projected. The viewpoint sense extends 360 degrees from the viewpoint but experiences the same limitations as the sense it is projecting. Example: Thoth Amon's spell viewpoint finally exits the underground stream, allowing him to spy upon the Dark Trolls in the cavern. Seeing nothing but darkness in all directions, he realizes the Dark Trolls are using their Dark Sense underground rather than normal light sources. Much to his chagrin, all he can detect is the utter darkness of an underground cavern. Spells can be cast through the point, with the casting range measured from the point. An enemy using magical vision spells (including a shaman's innate Second Sight) can see this viewpoint and can attack it. Magical weapons and spells cast at the point will affect the caster of the Projection spell in random locations, as needs be, and forces the caster to make a Concentration roll to maintain the spell, regardless of whether or not any damage was taken. It is thus possible for the caster to not take damage yet be forced to drop the spell. Example: As Thoth Amon considers recasting the Sight Projection after casting a Catseye spell from a looted spell matrix, the Dark Troll shaman he couldn't see in the cavern's blackness detects the spell viewpoint and launches a Befuddle boosted by 5 magic points. Thoth Amon suddenly wonders what he's doing in a cave and the automatic confusion caused by the Befuddle spell forces his Sense Projection spell to collapse, protecting him from any further attacks. --- spell description ends --- From leonbk at yahoo.com Fri Aug 20 04:14:55 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 11:14:55 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question In-Reply-To: <17274669.1092938739212.JavaMail.root@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20040819181500.26323.qmail@web41101.mail.yahoo.com> --- David Smart wrote: Spells can be cast through the point, with the casting range measured from the point. This is kind of rude. It would allow sorcerers to cast spells with out the need to increase Range as well as without fear of being atacked (if the opposition does not have a magical sight spell) I think the Projection is a good enough spell without giving it this kind of additional power. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From jurrubin at earthlink.net Fri Aug 20 04:16:36 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 13:16:36 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <32749345.1092939396138.JavaMail.root@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Is anyone else getting duplicate posts from the list? I've occasionally been receiving two of each post since yesterday. David From jurrubin at earthlink.net Fri Aug 20 04:22:00 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 13:22:00 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <19813337.1092939720808.JavaMail.root@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Hmm. I need to check on that. I also consider it to be overpowered but thought the section in question was part of the original spell description in the Spell book. Even if the range is calculated from the _caster's_ position, rather than the viewpoint's, Projection if an Active spell. Doesn't casting another spell with an Active one in use automatically kill the Active spell? David -----Original Message----- From: Leon Kirshtein Sent: Aug 19, 2004 1:14 PM To: David Smart , "RuneQuest rules discussion." Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question --- David Smart wrote: Spells can be cast through the point, with the casting range measured from the point. This is kind of rude. It would allow sorcerers to cast spells with out the need to increase Range as well as without fear of being atacked (if the opposition does not have a magical sight spell) From slposey at concentric.net Fri Aug 20 04:56:29 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 11:56:29 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question In-Reply-To: <19813337.1092939720808.JavaMail.root@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> References: <19813337.1092939720808.JavaMail.root@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <4124F7DD.8010307@concentric.net> David Smart wrote: > Hmm. I need to check on that. > > I also consider it to be overpowered but thought the section in question > was part of the original spell description in the Spell book. Even if the > range is calculated from the _caster's_ position, rather than the viewpoint's, > Projection if an Active spell. Doesn't casting another spell with an > Active one in use automatically kill the Active spell? IMO, that would be alright then. If you require that the second spell have its Range calculated based on the caster's position rather than the viewpoint's, and the casting of the second spell immediately automatically cancels the Projection, it just becomes a specialized targeting method. Anyone see any other problems with that? Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From leonbk at yahoo.com Fri Aug 20 05:09:35 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 12:09:35 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question In-Reply-To: <4124F7DD.8010307@concentric.net> Message-ID: <20040819190935.14843.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> --- Stephen Posey wrote: > If you require that the second spell > have its Range calculated based on the caster's > position rather than the > viewpoint's, and the casting of the second spell > immediately > automatically cancels the Projection, it > just becomes a specialized targeting method. > > Anyone see any other problems with that? Yes I still see a problem. It still allows the caster to "shoot" through meters of rock with out exposing himself at all! Now think about him beeing Mindlinked with a friendly Priest. Can you say Sever Spirit from no where. Projection is a great spell without this extra bit. With it, it would be just a matter of time before it is abused by players. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com _______________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Win 1 of 4,000 free domain names from Yahoo! Enter now. http://promotions.yahoo.com/goldrush From jurrubin at earthlink.net Fri Aug 20 05:23:14 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 14:23:14 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <7512819.1092943394811.JavaMail.root@louie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> The more I think about it, the more I prefer Projection to be a true Active spell. As such, it would block the casting of any other spell by the same caster as long as it's in effect. Casting a second spell would immediately drop the Projection, not allowing it to be used for targeting purposes if the second spell requires viewing the specific target. It could, however, be used to target area-effect spells, given that the Projection caster would know the general range and direction of the target area even after the Projection spell is dropped. I'm also thinking that Passive spells which allow the sharing of spell knowledge and sensory input would allow others to use the Projection caster's extended sense as a form of Forward Observer. I don't have my books with me at the moment to see is such Passive spells exist. Whether there is or not, an intelligent, spell-casting familiar should be able do so. With a little forethought, "Firing for effect!" could become a common response from a sorceror's familiar. *grin* David -----Original Message----- From: Stephen Posey Sent: Aug 19, 2004 1:56 PM To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question David Smart wrote: > Hmm. I need to check on that. > > I also consider it to be overpowered but thought the section in question > was part of the original spell description in the Spell book. Even if the > range is calculated from the _caster's_ position, rather than the viewpoint's, > Projection if an Active spell. Doesn't casting another spell with an > Active one in use automatically kill the Active spell? IMO, that would be alright then. If you require that the second spell have its Range calculated based on the caster's position rather than the viewpoint's, and the casting of the second spell immediately automatically cancels the Projection, it just becomes a specialized targeting method. Anyone see any other problems with that? Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From jurrubin at earthlink.net Fri Aug 20 05:25:30 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 14:25:30 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <7722677.1092943530518.JavaMail.root@louie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Ah! Mindlink..yep, that's the spell I was thinking about. Looks like Projection really needs to be an true Active spell and not allow any other spell to be cast through it. Spells affecting the caster's senses need to be in effect before the Projection is cast. David -----Original Message----- From: Leon Kirshtein Sent: Aug 19, 2004 2:09 PM To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question --- Stephen Posey wrote: > If you require that the second spell > have its Range calculated based on the caster's > position rather than the > viewpoint's, and the casting of the second spell > immediately > automatically cancels the Projection, it > just becomes a specialized targeting method. > > Anyone see any other problems with that? Yes I still see a problem. It still allows the caster to "shoot" through meters of rock with out exposing himself at all! Now think about him beeing Mindlinked with a friendly Priest. Can you say Sever Spirit from no where. Projection is a great spell without this extra bit. With it, it would be just a matter of time before it is abused by players. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com _______________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Win 1 of 4,000 free domain names from Yahoo! Enter now. http://promotions.yahoo.com/goldrush _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From leonbk at yahoo.com Fri Aug 20 05:34:04 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 12:34:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question In-Reply-To: <7512819.1092943394811.JavaMail.root@louie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20040819193404.3801.qmail@web41102.mail.yahoo.com> --- David Smart wrote: > Whether there is or not, an intelligent, > spell-casting familiar should be able do so. With a > little forethought, "Firing for effect!" could > become a common response from a sorceror's familiar. > *grin* You are still allowing spells to go through walls and won't be just the familiars. It will be held spells and Mindlinked characters. Its a Pandora's Box, you don't want to go there. Look at it this way, you would not allow a caster to target someone if the caster had a bunch of mirrors setup to give him a view around a U shaped turn. Then why let them do it with this spell? ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From jurrubin at earthlink.net Fri Aug 20 05:40:28 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 14:40:28 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <23675365.1092944428101.JavaMail.root@louie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Heh. You're right; I wouldn't allow such use of mirrors. We're of the same thought; casting other spells through a Projection is unbalancing and shouldn't be allowed. *sigh* Now how to explain that to my players who have already done so? I really hate countermanding something I've already allowed to happen. David -----Original Message----- From: Leon Kirshtein Sent: Aug 19, 2004 2:34 PM To: David Smart , "RuneQuest rules discussion." Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question --- David Smart wrote: > Whether there is or not, an intelligent, > spell-casting familiar should be able do so. With a > little forethought, "Firing for effect!" could > become a common response from a sorceror's familiar. > *grin* You are still allowing spells to go through walls and won't be just the familiars. It will be held spells and Mindlinked characters. Its a Pandora's Box, you don't want to go there. Look at it this way, you would not allow a caster to target someone if the caster had a bunch of mirrors setup to give him a view around a U shaped turn. Then why let them do it with this spell? ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From slposey at concentric.net Fri Aug 20 05:50:31 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 12:50:31 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question In-Reply-To: <20040819190935.14843.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040819190935.14843.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <41250487.2030008@concentric.net> Leon Kirshtein wrote: > --- Stephen Posey wrote: > >>If you require that the second spell >>have its Range calculated based on the caster's >>position rather than the >>viewpoint's, and the casting of the second spell >>immediately >>automatically cancels the Projection, it >>just becomes a specialized targeting method. >> >>Anyone see any other problems with that? > > > Yes I still see a problem. It still allows the caster > to "shoot" through meters of rock with out exposing > himself at all! > > Now think about him beeing Mindlinked with a friendly > Priest. Can you say Sever Spirit from no where. > > Projection is a great spell without this extra > bit. With it, it would be just a matter of time before > it is abused by players. I suppose I buy all this; but it still seems damn useful and something that makes a sort of sense given how I conceive magic working, but you're right that it's real open to abuse. It occurs to me that an alternate approach to achieve CLOSE to the same effect is to use Projection to "visit" the location, so that it is a valid target for a Teleportation. Teleport there, cast the second spell, then pop out real quick. Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From grogthing at yahoo.com Fri Aug 20 06:19:20 2004 From: grogthing at yahoo.com (grogthing) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 13:19:20 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20040819201920.78593.qmail@web41504.mail.yahoo.com> I use the descriptive verbage as well, but it is tied to D% scale instead of a D20 scale. 0% Untrained 01-19 Novice 20-39 Proficient 40-59 Professional 60-79 Adept/Veteran 80-89 Elite 90-++ Master There would only be disconnect if looking at the skill percentage as a chance to do something without taking into account the difficulty level of the task as well. In my system you must total 100% to accomplish an action. Anything less than 100% is the percentage of the action completed. Anything over 100% is applied to extra success. D% roll modifiers for difficulty of action - +50 Simple +25 Routine 0 Average -25 Difficult -50 Formidable It seems as though we are on similar tracks although I still like D% better ;) Greg --- Andrew Mellinger wrote: > On Thu, 19 Aug 2004, grogthing wrote: > > > Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 07:14:18 -0700 (PDT) > > From: grogthing > > Reply-To: RuneQuest rules discussion. > > > To: RuneQuest rules discussion. > > > Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution > and the dreaded D20 > > > > Switch from D% to D20? Why? > > > > I am writing a game that is strictly D% (abilities > as > > well as skills) kind of a customized blend of BRP > and > > the old FASA Star Trek system, because I feel D% > > percentile is easier to understand than any other > > numbering/rating system. > > > > Percentile evaluation is ingrained in our language > as > > a way to communicate the chance of success to > someone. > > > > You've got a 50%/50% chance. I'm 100% sure about > that. > > Before I get into my real point I want to mention > that a lot of people > are better at odds (1 in 10 or 1 in 6) than numbers > liks 31%. > > I used to argue this as well, but I've changed my > tune over the years, > here's why. > > Because everyone understands percentiles, they > immediately think they > know what it means. "I have a 50 in my skill so I > should be able to hit > the guy one out of every two times." But under what > conditions and when? > All of a sudden the guy can dodge and you're not > hitting any more. So the > 50/50 doesn't really matter. > > What we found (and believe me when I say this) > was that players (of all > levels) we misled about the context of that skill > level. Once you add in > any other factors, which are always there, you've > lost that level of > understanding. > > When we switch to D20 we created a skill mapping > to description. (Got > the idea from RQ AiG). > > 3 = Noveice > 6 = Student > 9 = Trained > 12 = Skilled > 15 = Expert > 18 = Master > > We then made sure to design, describe and > calibrate every skill so that > people can do what they expect a person of that > skill level to be able to > do. Obviously, there is disagreement about this > too, but a lot less than > about what a number means. > > So when a person has a skill of 12 and they are > trying to do something, > they think "Should a skilled person be able to do > that." > > Or a master (18) with some wounds is now at a > skill of 12. He knows he > is fighting as effectively as someone who is > skilled. > > When we design a new skill, we say "What should > somebody who is skilled > be able to accomplish?" > > Also, we have tables to show training time to > skill. We can determine > what the average starting level for some based off > of training is. Thus > we can say "A person who had this many weeks of > training can do this." We > convert the weeks to skill level (from out table) > then use that skill > level to drive the definition of the skill. > > Players really seem to like the Trained, Skilled, > Expert verbage and > relate to it very well. > > -Andrew > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > ===== "I have sworn, upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." - Thomas Jefferson "It does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." - Thomas Jefferson "Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry "A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious." - Aristotle _______________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Win 1 of 4,000 free domain names from Yahoo! Enter now. http://promotions.yahoo.com/goldrush From peter.brink at brinkdata.se Fri Aug 20 06:36:59 2004 From: peter.brink at brinkdata.se (Peter Brink) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 22:36:59 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question References: <20040819190935.14843.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <007b01c4862c$472e5bc0$9d2aa8c0@skadebyran.se> On Thursday, August 19, 2004 9:09 PM, Leon Kirshtein wrote: > --- Stephen Posey wrote: >> If you require that the second spell >> have its Range calculated based on the caster's >> position rather than the >> viewpoint's, and the casting of the second spell >> immediately >> automatically cancels the Projection, it >> just becomes a specialized targeting method. >> >> Anyone see any other problems with that? > > Yes I still see a problem. It still allows the caster > to "shoot" through meters of rock with out exposing > himself at all! > > Now think about him beeing Mindlinked with a friendly > Priest. Can you say Sever Spirit from no where. > > Projection is a great spell without this extra > bit. With it, it would be just a matter of time before > it is abused by players. Since (Sense) Projection is an active spell a Sorcerer needs to succeed with an concentration roll (INT x 3) to be able to do *anything* other than maintaining it. He would also quite possibly need to use the multispell skill, and he would also be wide open for magical attacks while casting the second spell, the viewpoint being a homing device back to him... Btw a farsee spell could also be used in a similar way, only it's not active... A friend of a sorcerer could cast the farsee on him, and presto... From leonbk at yahoo.com Fri Aug 20 06:43:24 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 13:43:24 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question In-Reply-To: <007b01c4862c$472e5bc0$9d2aa8c0@skadebyran.se> Message-ID: <20040819204324.26440.qmail@web41112.mail.yahoo.com> --- Peter Brink wrote: > Btw a farsee spell could also be used in > a similar way, only it's not active... A friend of a > sorcerer could cast the farsee on him, and presto... Not even close. A farsee is a set of binoculars. it does not bring the target closer and you still have to have a line of sight. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From bick10 at comcast.net Fri Aug 20 06:59:28 2004 From: bick10 at comcast.net (bick10 at comcast.net) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 20:59:28 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <081920042059.24907.412514AF0007C1400000614B2200737478CFCE050C070D@comcast.net> > --- Peter Brink wrote: > > Btw a farsee spell could also be used in > > a similar way, only it's not active... A friend of a > > sorcerer could cast the farsee on him, and presto... > Leon Kirshtein > Not even close. A farsee is a set of binoculars. it > does not bring the target closer and you still have to > have a line of sight. This brings up range. No matter where the Projection sence reaches, I would still count the range as from the caster, not the point of projection. Not saying I support casting spell through a projection. Just saying range should apply from the caster to target. From grogthing at yahoo.com Fri Aug 20 07:55:39 2004 From: grogthing at yahoo.com (grogthing) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 14:55:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question In-Reply-To: <081920042059.24907.412514AF0007C1400000614B2200737478CFCE050C070D@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20040819215539.375.qmail@web41504.mail.yahoo.com> I like sorcery to be powerful and scary. It is standard fantasy fare for a sorcerer to use a scrying device (crystal ball, palantir, seeing pool, etc) to see pretty much anywhere he wants to, inside caves, in castles, thru walls whatever. It is scary. It should be. The only defence is cloaking magic or barrier warding. Greg --- bick10 at comcast.net wrote: > > --- Peter Brink wrote: > > > Btw a farsee spell could also be used in > > > a similar way, only it's not active... A friend > of a > > > sorcerer could cast the farsee on him, and > presto... > > Leon Kirshtein > > Not even close. A farsee is a set of binoculars. > it > > does not bring the target closer and you still > have to > > have a line of sight. > This brings up range. No matter where the > Projection sence reaches, I would still count the > range as from the caster, not the point of > projection. Not saying I support casting spell > through a projection. Just saying range should > apply from the caster to target. > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > ===== "I have sworn, upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." - Thomas Jefferson "It does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." - Thomas Jefferson "Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry "A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious." - Aristotle _______________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Win 1 of 4,000 free domain names from Yahoo! Enter now. http://promotions.yahoo.com/goldrush From phil.hibbs at capgemini.com Fri Aug 20 19:21:23 2004 From: phil.hibbs at capgemini.com (Hibbs, Phil) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 10:21:23 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Sorcery Question Message-ID: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E98271@exast02.capgemini.co.uk> Simon Phipp: >We played that the spell created a visible copy of the organ - an eye, >tongue, ear, nose or hand. And Project Earthsense would create a floating beard, I presume. Phil Hibbs Our name has changed. Please update your address book to the following format: "recipient at capgemini.com". This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. From phil.hibbs at capgemini.com Fri Aug 20 19:28:23 2004 From: phil.hibbs at capgemini.com (Hibbs, Phil) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 10:28:23 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E98272@exast02.capgemini.co.uk> Leon Kirshtien: >You are still allowing spells to go through walls and >won't be just the familiars. It will be held spells >and Mindlinked characters. Its a Pandora's Box, you >don't want to go there. It all depends on the players and the characters. Some people would abuse this, others would not. If it works for your game, go for it. For instance, Simon Phipp and I have disagreed in the past as to whether Extension can be re-gained while an extended spell is still in effect. In his game, at his group's characters' power level, I can see that it would get out of hand. However, it worked for us, so we used it. Phil Hibbs Our name has changed. Please update your address book to the following format: "recipient at capgemini.com". This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. From soltakss at yahoo.com Fri Aug 20 20:42:21 2004 From: soltakss at yahoo.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?Simon=20Phipp?=) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 11:42:21 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Sorcery Question In-Reply-To: <20040819201934.B0C3422276E@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: <20040820104221.18201.qmail@web51010.mail.yahoo.com> This has turned out to be a far longer post than I had anticipated. Still, we must fight for some high level and powerful spells, musn't we? Leon Kirshtein: > --- David Smart wrote: > Spells can be cast through the point, with the > casting range measured from the point. > > This is kind of rude. It would allow sorcerers to cast > spells with out the need to increase Range as well as > without fear of being atacked (if the opposition does > not have a magical sight spell) and David Smart: > I also consider it to be overpowered but thought the section in question > was part of the original spell description in the Spell book. Even if the > range is calculated from the _caster's_ position, rather than the > viewpoint's, Projection if an Active spell. Doesn't casting another > spell with an Active one in use automatically kill the Active spell? In our campaign, this didn't cause a problem. Concentration rolls, as below, solves most problems. and Stephen Posey: > IMO, that would be alright then. If you require that the second spell > have its Range calculated based on the caster's position rather than the > viewpoint's, and the casting of the second spell immediately > automatically cancels the Projection, it just becomes a > specialized targeting method. > > Anyone see any other problems with that? It makes it too down powered and causes the sorcerer to have to roll the range twice, once for each spell. If you are going to use it as a specialised targeting device then you shouldn't up the range. and Leon Kirshtein: > Yes I still see a problem. It still allows the caster > to "shoot" through meters of rock with out exposing > himself at all! > > Now think about him beeing Mindlinked with a friendly > Priest. Can you say Sever Spirit from no where. > > Projection is a great spell without this extra > bit. With it, it would be just a matter of time before > it is abused by players. If players abuse things then I let NPCs abuse it in the same way. There are more NPCs than PCs and they have better spells and higher POW. Eventually the PCs will realise that they can't use it all the time. Also, give them a shock now and again. Have a basilisk see the spell and give it a hard stare or make it pass through a Thed Chaos Void. That has the desired effect of making them a loss less free with the spell. and David Smart: > The more I think about it, the more I prefer Projection to be a > true Active spell. As such, it would block the casting of any other spell > by the same caster as long as it's in effect. Casting a second spell would > immediately drop the Projection, not allowing it to be used for targeting > purposes if the second spell requires viewing the specific target. In RQ2, active spells dropped when the user was hurt or cast other spells. In RQ3 the spell stays up with a concentration roll. RQ3 is better, I think, in this respect. > It could, however, be used to target area-effect spells, given that the > Projection caster would know the general range and direction of the target > area even after the Projection spell is dropped. > > I'm also thinking that Passive spells which allow the sharing of spell > knowledge and sensory input would allow others to use the Projection > caster's extended sense as a form of Forward Observer. I don't have my > books with me at the moment to see is such Passive spells exist. Now this is dnagerous. Better to keep it so the caster can see through it and nobody else, otherwise you can get other people casting spells through it, something that mindlink specificaly does not allow, for instance. > Whether there is or not, an intelligent, spell-casting familiar should be > able do so. With a little forethought, "Firing for effect!" could become a > common response from a sorceror's familiar. *grin* Absolutely not, in my opinion. Familiars and magic spirits/allied spirits can see through their master's senses, not through Sense Projection spells cast by their masters. See note 3 below. and David Smart: > Ah! Mindlink..yep, that's the spell I was thinking about. Doesn't chain across more than one link. > Looks like Projection really needs to be an true Active spell and > not allow any other spell to be cast through it. Spells affecting the > caster's senses need to be in effect before the Projection is cast. This makes it next to useless. We had people teleporting through a Sight Projection spell to ambush enemies with devastating effect. Casting spells through it is what it was designed for. and Leon Kirshtein: > You are still allowing spells to go through walls and > won't be just the familiars. It will be held spells > and Mindlinked characters. Its a Pandora's Box, you > don't want to go there. Pandora's Boxes are meant to be opened, that's their whole point. > Look at it this way, you would not allow a caster to > target someone if the caster had a bunch of mirrors > setup to give him a view around a U shaped turn. Then > why let them do it with this spell? Spells are line of sight and are ranged from the casting point. With Sense Projection, line of sight/range is measured from the casting point which is the Sense Projection spell point. Mirrors are not line of sight. and David Smart: > Heh. You're right; I wouldn't allow such use of mirrors. We're of the same > thought; casting other spells through a Projection is unbalancing > and shouldn't be allowed. Absolutely not, It is only unbalancing at very low levels, where the skills are so low that the spell is effectively useless. At higher levels it is dangerous but not unbalancing. > *sigh* > > Now how to explain that to my players who have already done so? I really > hate countermanding something I've already allowed to happen. Don't. Allow it but explain to the players that if they can use it then so can NPCs. If you are still of the opinion that it should be banned, then explain the reasons that you set out here. Most PCs are very tolerant of spells being banned as being too powerful. Generally, from past experience, it was not that highly powered at all. 1. Maintaining an active spell for long periods of time requires myltuplie concentration rolls, perhaps once every game turn. 2. Casting a spell through the Projection means the caster must make a concentration roll for the spell to stay up (not a problem for a single crackle-zap attempt) and you might consider making the second spell fail if the concentration roll is failed. This is because the concentration roll is to keep the spell working while you cast the spell. 3. Mindlinked people cannot access the Projection spell's view-point, in the same way that Mindlink is not propogated through multiple links. So, if A is mindlinked to B and B is mindlinked to C and A has a Sight Projection spell then only A can see thorugh the Sense Projection, A can cast B's spells through the Sight Projection but B can't see the Projection and A can't cast C's spells. 4. Sorcerers are supposed to be powerful. 5. Shamans can discorporate, travel a long way, become Visible and cast spells. Priests with the Vision spell (used to be Common Divine, now I am not sure) can do the same as sorcerers but at a limited range. 6. Sorcerers casting Projection spells through large thicknesses of earth must make so many Concentration spells that the spell becomes effectively useless. 7. Any sorcerer using a long range Sense Projection spell would probably only use it against powerful opponents, so would be at risk from counter spells. 8. An NPC sorcerer using such spells against weak PCs would be doing it as part of a GM plot device, so such tactics are inherently allowed. This should either (a) teach the PCs a lesson that NPCs are dangerous or (b) show that a dangerous NPC is attacking them, causing them to attack back as only PCs know how. See Ya Simon ___________________________________________________________ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From andrew at crashbox.com Fri Aug 20 21:56:20 2004 From: andrew at crashbox.com (Andrew Mellinger) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 04:56:20 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 In-Reply-To: <20040819201920.78593.qmail@web41504.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040819201920.78593.qmail@web41504.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Aug 2004, grogthing wrote: > I use the descriptive verbage as well, but it is tied > to D% scale instead of a D20 scale. > > It seems as though we are on similar tracks although I > still like D% better ;) Definitely! I can't see how a person can play for a long time and not find a way to map their skill levels (whether % or d20) to some sort of real-life measure. We still prefer d20 becuse we only like rolling one die and the math is simpler. And I hate people who roll two d10's then choose one randomly for the ten's. One of my players indicated that for 10's he used the one that hit the table first. (Or that he saw first) or whatever. Boy was that a pain in the ass. I made him get the ones that actually have the tens on them. -Andrew > > Greg > > > --- Andrew Mellinger wrote: > >> On Thu, 19 Aug 2004, grogthing wrote: >> >>> Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 07:14:18 -0700 (PDT) >>> From: grogthing >>> Reply-To: RuneQuest rules discussion. >> >>> To: RuneQuest rules discussion. >> >>> Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution >> and the dreaded D20 >>> >>> Switch from D% to D20? Why? >>> >>> I am writing a game that is strictly D% (abilities >> as >>> well as skills) kind of a customized blend of BRP >> and >>> the old FASA Star Trek system, because I feel D% >>> percentile is easier to understand than any other >>> numbering/rating system. >>> >>> Percentile evaluation is ingrained in our language >> as >>> a way to communicate the chance of success to >> someone. >>> >>> You've got a 50%/50% chance. I'm 100% sure about >> that. >> >> Before I get into my real point I want to mention >> that a lot of people >> are better at odds (1 in 10 or 1 in 6) than numbers >> liks 31%. >> >> I used to argue this as well, but I've changed my >> tune over the years, >> here's why. >> >> Because everyone understands percentiles, they >> immediately think they >> know what it means. "I have a 50 in my skill so I >> should be able to hit >> the guy one out of every two times." But under what >> conditions and when? >> All of a sudden the guy can dodge and you're not >> hitting any more. So the >> 50/50 doesn't really matter. >> >> What we found (and believe me when I say this) >> was that players (of all >> levels) we misled about the context of that skill >> level. Once you add in >> any other factors, which are always there, you've >> lost that level of >> understanding. >> >> When we switch to D20 we created a skill mapping >> to description. (Got >> the idea from RQ AiG). >> >> 3 = Noveice >> 6 = Student >> 9 = Trained >> 12 = Skilled >> 15 = Expert >> 18 = Master >> >> We then made sure to design, describe and >> calibrate every skill so that >> people can do what they expect a person of that >> skill level to be able to >> do. Obviously, there is disagreement about this >> too, but a lot less than >> about what a number means. >> >> So when a person has a skill of 12 and they are >> trying to do something, >> they think "Should a skilled person be able to do >> that." >> >> Or a master (18) with some wounds is now at a >> skill of 12. He knows he >> is fighting as effectively as someone who is >> skilled. >> >> When we design a new skill, we say "What should >> somebody who is skilled >> be able to accomplish?" >> >> Also, we have tables to show training time to >> skill. We can determine >> what the average starting level for some based off >> of training is. Thus >> we can say "A person who had this many weeks of >> training can do this." We >> convert the weeks to skill level (from out table) >> then use that skill >> level to drive the definition of the skill. >> >> Players really seem to like the Trained, Skilled, >> Expert verbage and >> relate to it very well. >> >> -Andrew >> _______________________________________________ >> RQ-Rules mailing list >> RQ-Rules at crashbox.com >> http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules >> > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules >> > > > ===== > "I have sworn, upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every > form of tyranny over the mind of man." - Thomas Jefferson > > "It does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." - Thomas Jefferson > > "Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry > > "A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious." - Aristotle > > > > _______________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Win 1 of 4,000 free domain names from Yahoo! Enter now. > http://promotions.yahoo.com/goldrush > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > From leonbk at yahoo.com Fri Aug 20 23:11:40 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 06:11:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Sorcery Question In-Reply-To: <20040820104221.18201.qmail@web51010.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040820131140.59181.qmail@web41102.mail.yahoo.com> >3. Mindlinked people cannot access the Projection spell's view-point, in the same way that Mindlink is not propogated through multiple links. So, if A is mindlinked to B and B is mindlinked to C and A has a Sight Projection spell then only A can see thorugh the Sense Projection, A can cast B's spells through the Sight Projection but B can't see the Projection and A can't cast C's spells. Its not the same. Mindlink allows the direct mind to mind communication between two people. If the caster can see or hear something, then the person Mindlinked with them would be able to as well. >4. Sorcerers are supposed to be powerful. That does not mean that each spell needs to be a killer. >5. Shamans can discorporate, travel a long way, become Visible and cast spells. ... but are subject to attacks on the spirit plane while they do so and while Visible (spirit spell) they can be seen by everyone and attacked in ways. >Priests with the Vision spell (used to be Common Divine, now I am not sure) can do the same as sorcerers but at a limited range. I do not have a description for this spell. Could someone please post it. >7. Any sorcerer using a long range Sense Projection spell would probably only use it against powerful opponents, so would be at risk from counter spells. I am less worried about that, then a sorcerer using it to look through a door and casting spells. >8. An NPC sorcerer using such spells against weak PCs would be doing it as part of a GM plot device, so such tactics are inherently allowed. This should either (a) teach the PCs a lesson that NPCs are dangerous or (b) show that a dangerous NPC is attacking them, causing them to attack back as only PCs know. Allowing a spell to have certain effects, so as to explain a plot device is rather lame. As a GM you can do these things and not even bother to explain. Of course, every GM must determine what is right for their world and the power level of their game. In my games, Projection is just that, it allows a caster to project their senses and thats enough. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From jurrubin at earthlink.net Sat Aug 21 00:03:22 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 09:03:22 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question Message-ID: <15455432.1093010602133.JavaMail.root@statler.psp.pas.earthlink.net> I've always figured what's good for the goose is good for the gander. As a GM, I've learned quite a few nasty tricks from various players over the years and had certain NPCs use them. My current group is flying high right now on how they turned the tables on a group of 15 orcs, 4 trolls, and an orc shaman. Time to give them the next lesson on effective combat magic use. I have to admit, for a group who had no interest in RQ in the beginning and haven't had alot of time to play, they've come along very nicely indeed. GMing for them is really fun but quite challenging. I almost wish I had an assistant GM to help me keep up with them! David -----Original Message----- From: "Hibbs, Phil" Sent: Aug 20, 2004 4:28 AM To: rq-rules at crashbox.com Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] Sorcery Question It all depends on the players and the characters. Some people would abuse this, others would not. If it works for your game, go for it. For instance, Simon Phipp and I have disagreed in the past as to whether Extension can be re-gained while an extended spell is still in effect. In his game, at his group's characters' power level, I can see that it would get out of hand. However, it worked for us, so we used it. From jurrubin at earthlink.net Sat Aug 21 00:18:18 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 09:18:18 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Sorcery Question Message-ID: <18689493.1093011498362.JavaMail.root@statler.psp.pas.earthlink.net> LOL. I myself am absolutely tickled by all the feedback on this topic. I have no problem with high level and powerful spells as long as there is some balance. Simon, you've swung my mind back to considering keeping the spell with some minor modifications. The one thing I believe will balance the spell is the use of Concentration rolls. Because the player running the sorcerer in the group has used only Instant duration spells in combat to date, I had completely forgotten to require Concentration rolls. Looks like I need to brush up on RQ magic. David -----Original Message----- From: Simon Phipp Sent: Aug 20, 2004 5:42 AM To: rq-rules at crashbox.com Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Sorcery Question This has turned out to be a far longer post than I had anticipated. Still, we must fight for some high level and powerful spells, musn't we? From jurrubin at earthlink.net Sat Aug 21 00:19:32 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 09:19:32 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 Message-ID: <26382112.1093011572855.JavaMail.root@statler.psp.pas.earthlink.net> My group uses two differently colored d10s and must call the "tens" color before rolling. It works. David -----Original Message----- From: Andrew Mellinger Sent: Aug 20, 2004 6:56 AM To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution and the dreaded D20 On Thu, 19 Aug 2004, grogthing wrote: > I use the descriptive verbage as well, but it is tied > to D% scale instead of a D20 scale. > > It seems as though we are on similar tracks although I > still like D% better ;) Definitely! I can't see how a person can play for a long time and not find a way to map their skill levels (whether % or d20) to some sort of real-life measure. We still prefer d20 becuse we only like rolling one die and the math is simpler. And I hate people who roll two d10's then choose one randomly for the ten's. One of my players indicated that for 10's he used the one that hit the table first. (Or that he saw first) or whatever. Boy was that a pain in the ass. I made him get the ones that actually have the tens on them. -Andrew > > Greg > > > --- Andrew Mellinger wrote: > >> On Thu, 19 Aug 2004, grogthing wrote: >> >>> Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 07:14:18 -0700 (PDT) >>> From: grogthing >>> Reply-To: RuneQuest rules discussion. >> >>> To: RuneQuest rules discussion. >> >>> Subject: Re: [RQ-Rules] RQ3, RQ2 task resolution >> and the dreaded D20 >>> >>> Switch from D% to D20? Why? >>> >>> I am writing a game that is strictly D% (abilities >> as >>> well as skills) kind of a customized blend of BRP >> and >>> the old FASA Star Trek system, because I feel D% >>> percentile is easier to understand than any other >>> numbering/rating system. >>> >>> Percentile evaluation is ingrained in our language >> as >>> a way to communicate the chance of success to >> someone. >>> >>> You've got a 50%/50% chance. I'm 100% sure about >> that. >> >> Before I get into my real point I want to mention >> that a lot of people >> are better at odds (1 in 10 or 1 in 6) than numbers >> liks 31%. >> >> I used to argue this as well, but I've changed my >> tune over the years, >> here's why. >> >> Because everyone understands percentiles, they >> immediately think they >> know what it means. "I have a 50 in my skill so I >> should be able to hit >> the guy one out of every two times." But under what >> conditions and when? >> All of a sudden the guy can dodge and you're not >> hitting any more. So the >> 50/50 doesn't really matter. >> >> What we found (and believe me when I say this) >> was that players (of all >> levels) we misled about the context of that skill >> level. Once you add in >> any other factors, which are always there, you've >> lost that level of >> understanding. >> >> When we switch to D20 we created a skill mapping >> to description. (Got >> the idea from RQ AiG). >> >> 3 = Noveice >> 6 = Student >> 9 = Trained >> 12 = Skilled >> 15 = Expert >> 18 = Master >> >> We then made sure to design, describe and >> calibrate every skill so that >> people can do what they expect a person of that >> skill level to be able to >> do. Obviously, there is disagreement about this >> too, but a lot less than >> about what a number means. >> >> So when a person has a skill of 12 and they are >> trying to do something, >> they think "Should a skilled person be able to do >> that." >> >> Or a master (18) with some wounds is now at a >> skill of 12. He knows he >> is fighting as effectively as someone who is >> skilled. >> >> When we design a new skill, we say "What should >> somebody who is skilled >> be able to accomplish?" >> >> Also, we have tables to show training time to >> skill. We can determine >> what the average starting level for some based off >> of training is. Thus >> we can say "A person who had this many weeks of >> training can do this." We >> convert the weeks to skill level (from out table) >> then use that skill >> level to drive the definition of the skill. >> >> Players really seem to like the Trained, Skilled, >> Expert verbage and >> relate to it very well. >> >> -Andrew >> _______________________________________________ >> RQ-Rules mailing list >> RQ-Rules at crashbox.com >> http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules >> > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules >> > > > ===== > "I have sworn, upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every > form of tyranny over the mind of man." - Thomas Jefferson > > "It does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." - Thomas Jefferson > > "Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry > > "A tyrant must put on the appearance of uncommon devotion to religion. Subjects are less apprehensive of illegal treatment from a ruler whom they consider god-fearing and pious." - Aristotle > > > > _______________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Win 1 of 4,000 free domain names from Yahoo! Enter now. > http://promotions.yahoo.com/goldrush > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules > _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From mattley at gmail.com Sat Aug 21 03:47:02 2004 From: mattley at gmail.com (Matt Conrad) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 12:47:02 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Nasty tricks: In-Reply-To: <15455432.1093010602133.JavaMail.root@statler.psp.pas.earthlink.net> References: <15455432.1093010602133.JavaMail.root@statler.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 09:03:22 -0500 (GMT-05:00), David Smart wrote: > I've always figured what's good for the goose is good for the gander. > > As a GM, I've learned quite a few nasty tricks from various players over the years and had certain NPCs use them. Want to share? Feel free to throw in, anybody. I'm (essentially) a new GM. So far our game hasn't had much combat, but I'd like to steal any clever ideas for when the players actually go up against foes with brains. Matt From peter at maranci.net Sat Aug 21 04:48:33 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 14:48:33 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Nasty Tricks Message-ID: <291480-220048520184833596@M2W098.mail2web.com> * Matt Conrad mattley at gmail.com wrote: > Want to share? Feel free to throw in, anybody. > I'm (essentially) a new GM. So far our game hasn't had much combat, > but I'd like to steal any clever ideas for when the players actually > go up against foes with brains. I've always thought that illusion has been badly underplayed, and not just in RuneQuest. Particularly in conjunction with good preparation. For example, an illusion of darkness or smoke can be remarkably effective. I seem to remember casting blobs of darkness around the heads of opponents. In systems where disbelief is possible, arrange a code word to let party members know that an illusion is being cast can be remarkably effective - particularly if the illusion covers a large area. A classic "trick" in RQ, of course, is to simultaneously attack with spirits as well as physical opponents. That way the PCs must chose *which* enemy to oppose. In the days of RQ2 I once had an NPC cast Befuddle on a PC, and then Harmonized a second PC and made him "attack" the first PC. Result: battle royale. :D The most important thing is to use common sense and good tactics. I remember one game where the party was considerably outnumbered. Nonetheless the GM had only one enemy attack each PC. Ganging up on party members one at a time would have been a far more effective technique. Of course, stupid NPCs might not think of this...but they'd have to be pretty dumb. ->Peter Maranci, peter at maranci.net Pete's RQ! - http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From jurrubin at earthlink.net Sat Aug 21 04:56:55 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (David Smart) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 13:56:55 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Nasty tricks: Message-ID: <3099402.1093028215477.JavaMail.root@louie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> One nasty trick that can be used by a sorcerer is to create a spell matrix that contains a pre-manipulated spell. For example, Palsy Intensity 7. Such a spell will be cast at Intensity 7 without manipulation by anyone able to use the item. A sorcerer can then further manipulate the Intensity even higher, resulting in some potentially incredible Intensities and "one shot, one kill" effects. The player with this item in my campaign has used INT spirits to hold all his non-critical spells. With virtually all his INT freed up (16 points in fact), he was able to launch an Intensity 23 Palsy at a hostile shaman's abdomen, dropping the shaman with one spell. Such a tactic can be used for any spell. The best trick is to create such a spell matrix to be usable by a sorcerer's familiar and train up the familiar in the casting of that spell. That way, the familiar can be winding up the spell while the sorcerer is busy with other things. I'd say the most powerful sorcerers are those who have figured out how to delegate spell casting to entities (spirits, familiars, etc.) under his control. Other nasty sorcerer tricks are using layered defenses such as Cast Back and Resist Magic and creating binding matrices that release the bound hostile spirit if touched by anyone other than the sorcerer. Someone else has mentioned using Sight Projection as a way to teleport into an area and attack without warning. David -----Original Message----- From: Matt Conrad Sent: Aug 20, 2004 12:47 PM To: "RuneQuest rules discussion." Subject: [RQ-Rules] Nasty tricks: On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 09:03:22 -0500 (GMT-05:00), David Smart wrote: > I've always figured what's good for the goose is good for the gander. > > As a GM, I've learned quite a few nasty tricks from various players over the years and had certain NPCs use them. Want to share? Feel free to throw in, anybody. I'm (essentially) a new GM. So far our game hasn't had much combat, but I'd like to steal any clever ideas for when the players actually go up against foes with brains. Matt _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From leonbk at yahoo.com Sat Aug 21 05:23:39 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 12:23:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Nasty tricks: In-Reply-To: <3099402.1093028215477.JavaMail.root@louie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20040820192339.90880.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> --- David Smart wrote: > One nasty trick that can be used by a sorcerer is to > create a spell matrix that contains a > pre-manipulated spell. For example, Palsy Intensity > 7. Such a spell will be cast at Intensity 7 without > manipulation by anyone able to use the item. Cost to create such an item = 7 POW!!! I don't see this happening very often, IMG at least. One of the tricks that I have seen used fairly well is to cast Fanaticism at an opponent to prevent them from parrying. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From bick10 at comcast.net Sat Aug 21 05:46:35 2004 From: bick10 at comcast.net (bick10 at comcast.net) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 19:46:35 +0000 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Nasty tricks: Message-ID: <082020041946.3704.4126551A000BADE200000E782200750784CFCE050C070D@comcast.net> > > As a GM, I've learned quite a few nasty tricks from various players over the > years and had certain NPCs use them. > > Want to share? Feel free to throw in, anybody. Cast Demoralize on the cavalryman, after they charge by. They will not be coming back for a second pass. Send Zombies after the primary archers and spear users. Impaling weapons only do 1 point and do not get impaling damage. Once had the last PC standing fighting Zombies, the Heavy Hoplite. Tower shield, spear, javelin. He ended up having to punch the last zombies. If they are mounted, Use set spears and archers. Damage from charging set spears is the mounts damage modify. Palsy is the escaping sorcerers friend. And give your NPC?s time to power up. Your players are doing it, so should the NPC?s. Jim Bickmeyer From soltakss at yahoo.com Sat Aug 21 07:03:47 2004 From: soltakss at yahoo.com (=?iso-8859-1?q?Simon=20Phipp?=) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 22:03:47 +0100 (BST) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Sorcery Question, Nasty tricks In-Reply-To: <20040820194701.99268222728@boomstick.screwheads.net> Message-ID: <20040820210347.71531.qmail@web51003.mail.yahoo.com> Leon Kirshtein: > >3. Mindlinked people cannot access the Projection > spell's view-point, in the same way that Mindlink is > not propogated through multiple links. So, if A is > mindlinked to B and B is mindlinked to C and A has a > Sight Projection spell then only A can see thorugh the > Sense Projection, A can cast B's spells through the > Sight Projection but B can't see the Projection and A > can't cast C's spells. > > Its not the same. Mindlink allows the direct mind to > mind communication between two people. If the caster > can see or hear something, then the person Mindlinked > with them would be able to as well. Yes, they can see through their normal senses, but I would play that they couldn't see through Sense Projection as that is a further jump. If you draw it as a diagram with each person as a node and each mindlink/sense projection as a line then the basic rule is that nobody can access a secondary node or link. That's the way I play it, anyway. > >4. Sorcerers are supposed to be powerful. > > That does not mean that each spell needs to be a > killer. Agreed, but I don't hink this is a killer. Multispelled Venom or Multispelled Palsy are killers. > >Priests with the Vision spell (used to be Common > Divine, now I am not sure) can do the same as > sorcerers but at a limited range. > > I do not have a description for this spell. Could > someone please post it. It was in RQ2 and was available to every cult. Vision (2 POW, Reusable, Temporal, Range 160m, Non-Stackable) This spell gives a viewpoint which may be up to 240m away from the spirit of the recipient of the spell. Looking from this viewpoint is approximately like looking through the character's eyes, but it gives a 180 degree view. After this spell is cast, the viewpoint can be moved at a speed of 3 metres a melee round, and turned 180 degrees in a melee round. The two motins can be combined. While using Vision, the character cannot use his own eyes. However, he can switch back and forth between the spell viewpoint and his own from one round to the next. Matt Conrad: > > As a GM, I've learned quite a few nasty tricks from various players over > the years and had certain NPCs use them. > > Want to share? Feel free to throw in, anybody. > > I'm (essentially) a new GM. So far our game hasn't had much combat, > but I'd like to steal any clever ideas for when the players actually > go up against foes with brains. Ganging up on a single PC is usually fatal. Have all the NPCs shoot at a single PC, normally the largest or one not carrying a shield. Give them Multimissiles for added effect. Eventually one will critical or impale. If the PCs are fighting in a line, one on one, have adjacent NPCs parry their own opponent and attack a different opponent. So, if A fights B and C fights D next to each other then have A parry B and C parry D but have A and C attack B. As Leon says, casting Fanatacism on an opponent is good for a laugh. If the opponent is Rune Level and you get the ally then even better as it can't heal him. Combining creatures with compatible chaos creatures is fun. Have an exploding broo fight alongside a highly inflammable one, when it dies it does damage to its attacker and hopefully sets off the other one and does more damage to the attacker. Use strengths wisely, keep a Jack o' Bear or a basilisk hidden when they harmonise/gaze. Have a chaot with Hypnotic Skin (INTx5 or stand and stare at the pretty pictures) be clearly visible to the attackers. Use werewolves against opponents with no runic weapons. Use gorps against people with no fire magic. Against cavalry opponents, attack the mounts. Horses cannot parry and don't have much armour on their legs. Leon Kirshtein: > > One nasty trick that can be used by a sorcerer is to > > create a spell matrix that contains a > > pre-manipulated spell. For example, Palsy Intensity > > 7. Such a spell will be cast at Intensity 7 without > > manipulation by anyone able to use the item. > > Cost to create such an item = 7 POW!!! > > I don't see this happening very often, IMG at least. The best part of creating such an item is that the PC will be on low POW for a while, so he will have a better chance of making POW gain rolls and will get the POW back reasonably quickly. Overcoming POW is more tricky, though, but GMs will probably feel sorry for him and give him some low-POW opponents for a while. See Ya Simon ___________________________________________________________ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From pmj at comhem.se Sat Aug 21 07:30:59 2004 From: pmj at comhem.se (Peter Johansson) Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 23:30:59 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Nasty Tricks In-Reply-To: <291480-220048520184833596@M2W098.mail2web.com> References: <291480-220048520184833596@M2W098.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <41266D93.8020908@comhem.se> peter at maranci.net wrote: >In the days of RQ2 I once had an NPC cast Befuddle on a PC, and then >Harmonized a second PC and made him "attack" the first PC. Result: battle >royale. :D > Oh yes, Harmonize, a sprit magic spell in RQ2, is a wonderful thing. As a player I once made an NPC walk of a cliff, never tried it as a GM though. A nasty, but clever, trick is to have Extinguish thrown at PC:s torches when they fight Trolls deep in cave systems. Befuddle is a great way to have major villains slip away if things turn bad. Set PC:s hair or clothes on fire with Ignite. Let initiated NPC:s make DI-rolls when they die. Last but not least, Gorps in murky waters is always fun. :-) /Peter J From jurrubin at earthlink.net Sun Aug 22 01:02:15 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (D. Smart) Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2004 10:02:15 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Nasty tricks: In-Reply-To: <20040820192339.90880.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040820192339.90880.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <412763F7.7090006@earthlink.net> Yeah, I thought he was insane to do it but he played the odds and won. The player running the sorceror spent 2 months studying the rules on sorcery and is really good at working within the campaign environment to maximize benefits. He's the best I've seen at running a sorcerer; better than me. David Leon Kirshtein wrote: >--- David Smart wrote: > > >>One nasty trick that can be used by a sorcerer is to >>create a spell matrix that contains a >>pre-manipulated spell. For example, Palsy Intensity >>7. Such a spell will be cast at Intensity 7 without >>manipulation by anyone able to use the item. >> >> > >Cost to create such an item = 7 POW!!! > >I don't see this happening very often, IMG at least. > >One of the tricks that I have seen used fairly well is >to cast Fanaticism at an opponent to prevent them from parrying. > >===== >Leon Kirshtein >www.godlearner.d2g.com > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! >http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > > > From jurrubin at earthlink.net Sun Aug 22 01:03:46 2004 From: jurrubin at earthlink.net (D. Smart) Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2004 10:03:46 -0500 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Nasty tricks: In-Reply-To: <082020041946.3704.4126551A000BADE200000E782200750784CFCE050C070D@comcast.net> References: <082020041946.3704.4126551A000BADE200000E782200750784CFCE050C070D@comcast.net> Message-ID: <41276452.3010701@earthlink.net> It's also the sniping sorcerer's friend. bick10 at comcast.net wrote: > > > >Palsy is the escaping sorcerers friend. > > > From patrice.bousquet at gso.fr Wed Aug 25 00:05:32 2004 From: patrice.bousquet at gso.fr (Patrice BOUSQUET) Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 16:05:32 +0200 Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?R=E9f=2E_=3A_Re=3A_[RQ-Rules]_Nasty_Tricks?= Message-ID: >A nasty, but clever, trick is to have Extinguish thrown at PC:s torches >when they fight Trolls deep in cave systems. I saw once a band of trolls (2 darks and half a dozen trolkins) fighting in daylight. The leader dark troll created a darkwall horizontally on top of the trollkin's heads, permitting them not to be demoralized by daylight. Bad day for their opponents... Patrice From leonbk at yahoo.com Wed Aug 25 01:11:04 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 08:11:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Réf._:_Re:_[RQ-Rules]_Nasty_Tricks In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20040824151104.89215.qmail@web41108.mail.yahoo.com> > I saw once a band of trolls (2 darks and half a > dozen trolkins) fighting in daylight. The leader > dark troll created a darkwall horizontally on top of > the trollkin's heads, permitting them not to be > demoralized by daylight. > Bad day for their opponents... If he created it over their heads then no problem, but I remeber reading somepalce that Troll's Darksense was not able to penetrate Darkwall and similar magical darkness. ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From peter at maranci.net Wed Aug 25 12:40:03 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (Peter Maranci) Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 22:40:03 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] My Bizarre Fantasy Message-ID: Okay, this is probably a totally insane idea. So with any luck it will sink here without a trace, and I can forget it. :D Realistically, Chaosium is going to have an uphill battle making a go of RQ/DBRP. It's a great system, but the market is pretty much owned by Hasbro. They'll need every selling point they can muster. The more high-quality scenarios and supplements there are online for DBRP/RQ, the more people are likely to try the system. Sound reasonable? So my bizarre fantasy is some sort of match-up board that helps put together writing teams to work on scenarios. A sort of RQ classified where writers, mappers, artists, playtesters, etc. can look for the other people they need to create some really good material. What do you think, sirs? ->Peter ---------------------------------------------------------------- Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net Woonsocket, RI Pete's RuneQuest & Roleplaying!: http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm From freyrvanic at earthlink.net Wed Aug 25 12:44:14 2004 From: freyrvanic at earthlink.net (Sven Lugar) Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 19:44:14 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] My Bizarre Fantasy Message-ID: <410-22004832524414843@earthlink.net> A valid idea. That way a whole professional looking package could be put together ready for publication. > [Original Message] > From: Peter Maranci > To: > Date: 8/24/2004 7:40:02 PM > Subject: [RQ-Rules] My Bizarre Fantasy > > Okay, this is probably a totally insane idea. So with any luck it will > sink here without a trace, and I can forget it. :D > > Realistically, Chaosium is going to have an uphill battle making a go > of RQ/DBRP. It's a great system, but the market is pretty much owned > by Hasbro. They'll need every selling point they can muster. The more > high-quality scenarios and supplements there are online for DBRP/RQ, > the more people are likely to try the system. Sound reasonable? > > So my bizarre fantasy is some sort of match-up board that helps put > together writing teams to work on scenarios. A sort of RQ classified > where writers, mappers, artists, playtesters, etc. can look for the > other people they need to create some really good material. > > What do you think, sirs? > > ->Peter > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net Woonsocket, RI > Pete's RuneQuest & Roleplaying!: http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm > _______________________________________________ > RQ-Rules mailing list > RQ-Rules at crashbox.com > http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules > http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From Michael.Christian at corbis.com Wed Aug 25 15:22:09 2004 From: Michael.Christian at corbis.com (Michael.Christian at corbis.com) Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 22:22:09 -0700 Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?RE=3A_R=E9f=2E_=3A_Re=3A_=5BRQ-Rules=5D_Nasty_T?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?ricks?= Message-ID: <306F012D0A00D611BC9D0008C79192741094219A@seamail1.continuum.corbis.corp> I don't remember the name, but isn't there a troll divine spell that basically creates a big area of darkness. I think it's an Argan Argar spell if I recall right. Of course Darkwall is probably a lot more common in folk's spell repertoires, and you use what you have on hand. -----Original Message----- From: rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com [mailto:rq-rules-bounces at crashbox.com]On Behalf Of Patrice BOUSQUET Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 7:06 AM To: RuneQuest rules discussion. Subject: R?f. : Re: [RQ-Rules] Nasty Tricks >A nasty, but clever, trick is to have Extinguish thrown at PC:s torches >when they fight Trolls deep in cave systems. I saw once a band of trolls (2 darks and half a dozen trolkins) fighting in daylight. The leader dark troll created a darkwall horizontally on top of the trollkin's heads, permitting them not to be demoralized by daylight. Bad day for their opponents... Patrice _______________________________________________ RQ-Rules mailing list RQ-Rules at crashbox.com http://www.crashbox.com/rq-rules http://www.crashbox.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rq-rules From gianni at basicrps.com Wed Aug 25 17:26:08 2004 From: gianni at basicrps.com (Gianni) Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 09:26:08 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] My Bizarre Fantasy In-Reply-To: <410-22004832524414843@earthlink.net> References: <410-22004832524414843@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <1093418768.412c3f1077898@imp.webhuset.no> Quoting Peter and Sven: > > So my bizarre fantasy is some sort of match-up board that helps put > > together writing teams to work on scenarios. A sort of RQ classified > > where writers, mappers, artists, playtesters, etc. can look for the > > other people they need to create some really good material. > > > > What do you think, sirs? > A valid idea. That way a whole professional looking package could be put > together ready for publication. Shouldn't we wait for the Advanced (or DeLuxe or whatever) Basic RPS rules to be published before we start this? I was myself writing my '2nd edition' Feudal China rules when news of the Basic RPS revival hit. I stopped working on them. Cheers Gianni webmaster of basicrps.com From Nick.Middleton at invensys.com Wed Aug 25 18:25:02 2004 From: Nick.Middleton at invensys.com (Nick.Middleton at invensys.com) Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 09:25:02 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] My Bizarre Fantasy Message-ID: >Quoting Gianni quoting Peter and Sven: > >> > So my bizarre fantasy is some sort of match-up board that helps put >> > together writing teams to work on scenarios. A sort of RQ classified >> > where writers, mappers, artists, playtesters, etc. can look for the >> > other people they need to create some really good material. >> > >> > What do you think, sirs? > >> A valid idea. That way a whole professional looking package could be put >> together ready for publication. > >Shouldn't we wait for the Advanced (or DeLuxe or whatever) Basic RPS rules to >be published before we start this? > >I was myself writing my '2nd edition' Feudal China rules when news of the Basic >RPS revival hit. I stopped working on them. > But this is the internet age: everyone wants everything NOW... ;-> More seriously, if something like this is needed/beneficial, having it in place BEFORE DBRP is published will speed development - but that's probably an argument for saying that this is something Chaosium should do... Cheers, Nick Middleton From peter.brink at brinkdata.se Wed Aug 25 20:12:08 2004 From: peter.brink at brinkdata.se (Peter Brink) Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 12:12:08 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Properties of a BRP/RQ portal Message-ID: <008301c48a8b$fb0eb9b0$9d2aa8c0@skadebyran.se> This is a crosspost to several mailinglists to let those interested in the idea of putting up a portal, for use by the BRP and RQ fan communities, know that I started a thread about what functionality such a website should have at www.rollspelshornan.se/brps (go to the Community board under Basic Roleplaying)It is really becoming a bit awkward to have this discussion running at the same time on several mailing list, so I think it would be better if we used the facilities of a webforum for the time being. Thanks, Peter Brink From peter at maranci.net Wed Aug 25 22:19:26 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 08:19:26 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] My Bizarre Fantasy Message-ID: <39260-220048325121926329@M2W090.mail2web.com> More categories: - Editor - Proofreader - Translator: [language] to [language] - Project Manager (for very large projects) - Rewriter: [language] - Programmer: [language] (probably not common, but it *could* be needed for an unusual project) - Idea man/woman - Fact checker Perhaps there should be another category, one that creates supplemental materials like newspaper clippings, etc. Just more wild ideas! ->Peter Maranci, peter at maranci.net Pete's RuneQuest & Roleplaying!: http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From peter at maranci.net Wed Aug 25 23:02:17 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 09:02:17 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Properties of a BRP/RQ portal Message-ID: <100060-220048325132171@M2W099.mail2web.com> I think you'll find that the difficulty lies in persuading everyone to give up their old forums/mailing lists/etc. and migrate to the new portal - ANY new portal. As we've seen in the last day or two, there are still some players - I'll bet a LOT of them (particularly the offline ones) - who have no knowledge of the impending changes. So trying to get everyone to go to a new portal site could present serious challenges. This relates, somewhat, to another issue I've raised on the Yahoo boards, but not here: the impending merger of the RQ/BRP communities. The topic hasn't really been addressed much, but if BRP and RQ are now one, that has some interesting implications for those who play and support that game system. Particularly if Call of Cthulhu is part of the package, since I suspect that it has the largest player base of any non-RQ BRP-derived game. The combined RQ/BRP is potentially much bigger than any individual component, but managing the consolidation of the various groups could be somewhat...tricky. ->Peter Maranci, peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From peter at maranci.net Wed Aug 25 23:25:12 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 09:25:12 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Trying to pull things together a bit Message-ID: <311830-220048325132512490@M2W082.mail2web.com> The conversation seems to be getting rapidly fragmented. I'd suggest that everyone interested in RQ/BRP should be aware of at least these three URLs (anyone, please feel free to add to this list): The RuneQuest-Rules Digest (email list) - http://www.crashbox.com/pipermail/rq-rules/ (this is the archive, with a link on how to join) Basic Role Playing System on Yahoo - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/brpsystem?yguid=76586427 RQ Addicts on Yahoo - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rqaddicts?yguid=76586427 I have posted this list to all three forums. ->Peter Maranci, peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From gianni at basicrps.com Thu Aug 26 00:20:25 2004 From: gianni at basicrps.com (Gianni) Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 16:20:25 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Trying to pull things together a bit In-Reply-To: <311830-220048325132512490@M2W082.mail2web.com> References: <311830-220048325132512490@M2W082.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <1093443625.412ca02966723@imp.webhuset.no> Quoting "peter at maranci.net" : > (anyone, please feel free to add to this list): > My own Basic RPS portal: http://www.basicrps.com/ and my own mailing-list through subscribe [at] basicrps.com Gianni webmaster of basicrps.com From peter at maranci.net Thu Aug 26 02:17:11 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 12:17:11 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Trying to pull things together a bit Message-ID: <270450-220048325161711994@M2W090.mail2web.com> Gianni, I've added your Basic RPS site to the RQ Discussion Boards page of the RQ wiki. If the description doesn't suit you, please feel free to edit it directly. http://www.runequest.org/index.php?RuneQuest%20Discussion%20Boards ->Peter Maranci, peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From peter at maranci.net Thu Aug 26 02:22:35 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 12:22:35 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] My Bizarre Fantasy Message-ID: <64810-220048325162235251@M2W079.mail2web.com> Hookay...I hope I'm not tromping on anyone's toes here, but I'm really bored today. So since the RQ/BRP journal doesn't really have much use, I put up my idea for the BRP/RQ creator classifieds there. So far there's one entry: mine. :D Here's the link: http://www.livejournal.com/community/runequest_brp/ I admit that a LiveJournal is not the ideal format to use for this sort of thing; it should really be something searchable, with automated matching and stuff. So if anyone can come up with a better way to do it, please let me know. Hmm...maybe there's something in the CPanel section of my site host. I'll have to check that... Okay, I've blathered on enough today! ->Peter Maranci, peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From phil.hibbs at capgemini.com Thu Aug 26 03:43:41 2004 From: phil.hibbs at capgemini.com (Hibbs, Phil) Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 18:43:41 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Nasty Tricks Message-ID: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E98292@exast02.capgemini.co.uk> The all-time greatest combination of all time has to be Absorbtion plus Extension. On yourself, and your fetch if you have one. Phil Hibbs. Our name has changed. Please update your address book to the following format: "recipient at capgemini.com". This message contains information that may be privileged or confidential and is the property of the Capgemini Group. It is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, disseminate, distribute, or use this message or any part thereof. If you receive this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this message. From leonbk at yahoo.com Thu Aug 26 03:55:46 2004 From: leonbk at yahoo.com (Leon Kirshtein) Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 10:55:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Nasty Tricks In-Reply-To: <993BE7B40B41D31193C50008C75F68F207E98292@exast02.capgemini.co.uk> Message-ID: <20040825175546.2088.qmail@web41115.mail.yahoo.com> Phil wrote: > The all-time greatest combination of all time has to > be Absorbtion plus > Extension. On yourself, and your fetch if you have > one. First, you got to have a fetch! But, why would you cast this on the fetch, it is unlikely to get targeted ===== Leon Kirshtein www.godlearner.d2g.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From gianni at basicrps.com Thu Aug 26 03:57:26 2004 From: gianni at basicrps.com (Gianni) Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 19:57:26 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] My Bizarre Fantasy In-Reply-To: <64810-220048325162235251@M2W079.mail2web.com> References: <64810-220048325162235251@M2W079.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <1093456646.412cd3069c284@imp.webhuset.no> Quoting "peter at maranci.net" : > Hookay...I hope I'm not tromping on anyone's toes here, but I'm really > bored today. So since the RQ/BRP journal doesn't really have much use, I > put up my idea for the BRP/RQ creator classifieds there. So far there's one > entry: mine. :D > > Here's the link: http://www.livejournal.com/community/runequest_brp/ How d'you add an entry? Cheers Gianni From peter at maranci.net Thu Aug 26 23:22:56 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (peter at maranci.net) Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 09:22:56 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] My Bizarre Fantasy Message-ID: <296980-220048426132256212@M2W024.mail2web.com> * Gianni gianni at basicrps.com wrote: > How d'you add an entry? Sigh. I am an idiot. I'd forgotten that you need to be a member of LiveJournal to initiate a post. Okay, looks like I'll have to dust off some of my site tools and create a community forum, or some such thing. Unfortunately for some mysterious reason I am blocked from my site tools when I'm at work (I can FTP and view the site, so it's not a firewall problem), so it will have to wait until tonight...or tomorrow night, if my game goes late this evening (D&D, Hobson's choice). I'll post here as soon as it's set up. ->Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net http://www.runequest.org/rq.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From alan.richards75 at ntlworld.com Sat Aug 28 07:10:53 2004 From: alan.richards75 at ntlworld.com (Alan Richards) Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 22:10:53 +0100 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Raw Magic Message-ID: <9464FF1E-F86D-11D8-BA65-000A277B64F4@ntlworld.com> Some months ago there was a short thread on Raw / Spontaneous magic. I have unearthed my old notes for some rules for this. Be warned they are broad/rough. And they were actually written for Stormbringer (3rd Edition). PS: to forestall the (inevitable?) calls of how open they are to misuse, I have always been very happy to overule the players / rules in favour of a 'better 'more fun game. SORCERY Any character with INT+POW greater than 31 may choose to be trained as a Sorcerer. (S)he has a Magical Power (MP) score. This is found by looking up (INT+POW+DEX) on the Melee column of the Damage Bonus chart. The range of a spell is (POW) x10m. The duration of a spell is (POW) combat rounds. Possible Magical skills Animal Empathy Deception Illusions Demon Summoning Demonology Healing Human Empathy Hydromancy Water Magic Lithomancy Earth Magic Perception Planar Travel (The Vadhagh ability to travel between worlds) Plant Empathy Protection Pyrokenesis Fire Magic Sending (The Vadhagh ability to see and speak between worlds) Spirit Summoning Shamanism Telekenesis Each skill starts at 00%. They are Knowledge skills Beginning characters (who qualify) may spend some of their initial 'other' skills to start play knowing 1 or more sorcerous skill. Magic Use The Player specifies the effect which they are looking for. They must then succeed in rolling under the relevent skill(s) to cast the spell. They may then need to make another roll DEX vs. DEX to hit with indirect-attack or missile type spells POW vs. POW to effect with direct-attack or transformation type spells POW vs. POW to control a summoned creature The effects: Destructive spells inflict a number of hits equal to Magical Power score Healing spells heal a number of hits equal to Magical Power score Summoning spells summons a creature with a POW equal to MP score Increasing Effect A Sorcerer may increase the effect of a spell. Each 1 step increase on the MP chart reduces the skill(s) used by 20%. Summoning The summoning skill summons a creature with POW equal to the MP roll. i.e. an MP roll of 2d6 might summon a Demon with POW=8. The creature / ghost / Demon has 1d6 for other characteristics per point of POW. i.e. the Demon above has 8d6 to be split amongst STR, CON, SIZ, INT, DEX and CHA From slposey at concentric.net Sat Aug 28 07:21:25 2004 From: slposey at concentric.net (Stephen Posey) Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 14:21:25 -0700 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Raw Magic In-Reply-To: <9464FF1E-F86D-11D8-BA65-000A277B64F4@ntlworld.com> References: <9464FF1E-F86D-11D8-BA65-000A277B64F4@ntlworld.com> Message-ID: <412FA5D5.4040205@concentric.net> Alan Richards wrote: > Some months ago there was a short thread on Raw / Spontaneous magic. I > have unearthed my old notes for some rules for this. > > Be warned they are broad/rough. And they were actually written for > Stormbringer (3rd Edition). > > PS: to forestall the (inevitable?) calls of how open they are to misuse, > I have always been very happy to overule the players / rules in favour > of a 'better 'more fun game. > > > SORCERY > > Any character with INT+POW greater than 31 may choose to be trained as a > Sorcerer. > > (S)he has a Magical Power (MP) score. This is found by looking up > (INT+POW+DEX) on the Melee column of the Damage Bonus chart. > > The range of a spell is (POW) x10m. > The duration of a spell is (POW) combat rounds. > > > Possible Magical skills Very interesting. Can you recount some cases of how this was used in your games or do you have some example characters to show? Stephen Posey slposey at concentric.net From peter at maranci.net Sat Aug 28 14:16:03 2004 From: peter at maranci.net (Peter Maranci) Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 00:16:03 -0400 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ Classified Message-ID: I've just put up the RQ Classified board. It's at http://maranci.net/forum/ . You can reach it from the sidebar on my main page as well. Just to clarify, the RQ Classified board is for RuneQuest/Deluxe Basic Roleplaying content creators. There are areas to post personal profiles (i.e. "Writer seeks artist for fantasy DBRP scenario"), collaborate on specific projects, and share/release ideas that you can't find a use for (but maybe someone else can). I don't expect the board to see a LOT of traffic; I don't know that there are that many people working on new RQ/DBRP material these days. But who knows? I may be wrong. I hope so. Anyone can post a profile or search for a profile; membership is not required, although some functions (like editing old posts, for example) are restricted to members. The whole thing is totally non-commercial, of course, just like the rest of my site. Okay, I'm done. I hope that wasn't too OT. :D ->Peter ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Peter Maranci peter at maranci.net Woonsocket, RI Pete's RuneQuest & Roleplaying! Adventures, art, an online game, NPCs, magic items, sheets, rules & much more: http://www.maranci.net/rq.htm From gianni at basicrps.com Sat Aug 28 23:13:14 2004 From: gianni at basicrps.com (Gianni) Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 15:13:14 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] RQ Classified In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1093698794.413084ea3a802@imp.webhuset.no> Hey Peter How d'you add a Sticky? Or are you the only one allowed to do do? Gianni From Tony.Den at standardbank.co.za Mon Aug 30 19:23:26 2004 From: Tony.Den at standardbank.co.za (Den, Tony T) Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2004 11:23:26 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] ArtHaus Publishing Acquires Pendragon Message-ID: <52B26EB23446704C801FCF722CF8D2063F25F1@scmbjhbmsg03.scmbdirectory.com> Friend sent this to me, was originally published by white wolf news: -----Original Message----- ArtHaus Publishing Acquires Pendragon Atlanta, GA, August 25, 2004 - ArtHaus Publishing and Peter Corless of Green Knight Publishing have reached an agreement for ArtHaus to acquire ownership of the Pendragon Arthurian roleplaying game. "It's with great pride that we become the publisher of Pendragon. This game is not only the first roleplaying game that emphatically stressed story over game mechanics, but the game mechanics themselves are so artfully designed that they actually add to the story and character development rather than detract," said Stewart Wieck of ArtHaus, which is a close publishing partner of White Wolf Publishing. "We're want above all for Pendragon to remain true to its artistic roots, but because of our position in the industry, we'll allow even more gamers the opportunity to see and play this great game." One of the most admired and enduring pen-and-paper roleplaying games of the last thirty years, Pendragon allows players to take on the role of knights at King Arthur's court. Originally developed by award-winning game designer Greg Stafford, Pendragon has been widely hailed for its trend-setting emphasis on morality and moving beyond the "slay the monster" archetype that once dominated fantasy roleplaying. Peter Corless acquired Pendragon from Chaosium, Inc. in 1998 and published under the Green Knight Press banner. "I am very pleased with ArtHaus' desire to carry on the Pendragon tradition of excellence in roleplaying and trust their dramatic vision and business capabilities," said Corless. "This will allow Green Knight to return to focus on other projects, such as Pendragon Online? and Pendragon Fiction?, while allowing the dice-and-paper roleplaying game fans a new source of products. ArtHaus has acquired all of Green Knights remaining back stock of Pendragon roleplaying products and White Wolf will begin selling them shortly. ArtHaus Publishing is a special projects publisher partnered with market-leader White Wolf Publishing. Under the ArtHaus banner, White Wolf has released a diverse array of roleplaying games. More information on the White Wolf family of brands can be found at www.white-wolf.com Green Knight Publishing is a premier publisher of fiction, games and entertainments revolving around the world of King Arthur, Merlin and the Knights of the Round Table. A private company based in Mountain View, in the San Francisco Bay Area, Green Knight Publishing was founded by Peter Corless in 1998. __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ For information about the Standard Bank group visit our web site __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Disclaimer and confidentiality note Everything in this e-mail and any attachments relating to the official business of Standard Bank Group Limited is proprietary to the group. It is confidential, legally privileged and protected by law. Standard Bank does not own and endorse any other content. Views and opinions are those of the sender unless clearly stated as being that of the group. The person addressed in the e-mail is the sole authorised recipient. Please notify the sender immediately if it has unintentionally reached you and do not read, disclose or use the content in any way. Standard Bank can not assure that the integrity of this communication has been maintained nor that it is free of errors, virus, interception or interference. ___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ From Tony.Den at standardbank.co.za Tue Aug 31 22:32:24 2004 From: Tony.Den at standardbank.co.za (Den, Tony T) Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 14:32:24 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Worlds for BRP Message-ID: <52B26EB23446704C801FCF722CF8D2063F2663@scmbjhbmsg03.scmbdirectory.com> You could just try and lay hands on Skyrealms of Jorune, which uses a floating islad concept. -----Original Message----- Rich Allen Do you have anything written up on this? My current campaign world is similar: the planet was blown apart by a spell gone wrong, but the wizards of the world had enough of a warning that they were able to negate most of the effects. The end result is large chunks of the planet as islands, large globes of ocean, lots of air between all orbiting a small, hot core. The "shattering" occured several thousand years before the current time, so the races have evolved to fit. Flying ships, new flying related spells and magic items, etc. (This is for D&D 3.5 but it would fit just about any game system). Rich Allen __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ For information about the Standard Bank group visit our web site __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Disclaimer and confidentiality note Everything in this e-mail and any attachments relating to the official business of Standard Bank Group Limited is proprietary to the group. It is confidential, legally privileged and protected by law. Standard Bank does not own and endorse any other content. Views and opinions are those of the sender unless clearly stated as being that of the group. The person addressed in the e-mail is the sole authorised recipient. Please notify the sender immediately if it has unintentionally reached you and do not read, disclose or use the content in any way. Standard Bank can not assure that the integrity of this communication has been maintained nor that it is free of errors, virus, interception or interference. ___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ From Tony.Den at standardbank.co.za Tue Aug 31 22:57:17 2004 From: Tony.Den at standardbank.co.za (Den, Tony T) Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 14:57:17 +0200 Subject: [RQ-Rules] Re: Worlds for BRP Message-ID: <52B26EB23446704C801FCF722CF8D2063F2664@scmbjhbmsg03.scmbdirectory.com> John Raner wrote: Too each his own I guess! :) I have always liked half-breeds... The idea of a race (orcs) which is fecund and can breed with most humanoid races appeals to me. Especially if said race is somewhat stupid, weak, etc. The half-breed might bring some of the advantages of the other parent into the tribal gene pool. I am of the opposite disposition. Problem is I did biology in high school and have this thing about chromosomes and cross breeding. So to me, unless an orc and say an human have same amount of chromosomes, its no go. __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ For information about the Standard Bank group visit our web site __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Disclaimer and confidentiality note Everything in this e-mail and any attachments relating to the official business of Standard Bank Group Limited is proprietary to the group. It is confidential, legally privileged and protected by law. Standard Bank does not own and endorse any other content. Views and opinions are those of the sender unless clearly stated as being that of the group. The person addressed in the e-mail is the sole authorised recipient. Please notify the sender immediately if it has unintentionally reached you and do not read, disclose or use the content in any way. Standard Bank can not assure that the integrity of this communication has been maintained nor that it is free of errors, virus, interception or interference. ___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________